Fwd: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!!
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net> What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was... ---Business Daily--- "we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame" <http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ardrz/-/index.html> "..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.." <http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bcyoz/-/index.html> ---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down - The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya. Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised. And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator? Alex
@Alex, on July 23rd , on the launch of Seacom, the entire telco sector shouted back to kenyans and said : We will dictate what happens and when it happens. But we are the ones who keep them in business. I'm not at all surprised about the article. It became evident a few days later that much more was going on behind the scenes. I read safcom letter printed in local dailies and saw one line that made all the sense of where teams was heading. I find this quote ( from BD article today ) quite interesting : “There is no onward connectivity between Europe and Dubai, where TEAMS ends. ” he said. And it is true that rates should have dropped by at least 50-90% on seacom ( pls read my contribute on contention ratios ) . Teams has created a bigger problem...........unless Govt willing to sell capacity bandwidth to smaller ISPs who will take the pricing battle further. My thots.... Rgds.
Alex, I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs, using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be forced tor resign on the same basis? Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes. Kiania. On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ardrz/-/index.html>
"..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bcyoz/-/index.html>
---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator?
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- [Asentric Consulting Ltd] If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth .... -Richest Man in Babylon
@ David I remember the *ps* at onetime in the news when he was cornered,he said he is responsible for the cable if it does not deliver he is putting his work on the line? so much money has been spend on this fiber optic ghost or rather cash cow and its we techies who will use it. when we have better speeds will have more jobs,more comfort,less hustle as we can work from home virtually.quick downloads,and virtually travel round the world in the comfort of own environment.more jobs from all over the world. without ever leaving our living room. jeezz!! This is what I was waiting for!!! But it seems things will never change The old gray hairs who by default own every big company and forever claim to be the youth,will never set as free. first, all they do with internet is to download mail,which has taken some ages to understand how secondly,they care less about the consumer and even the quality of service their companies offer are terrible They have no idea why we need better speeds. My begging question is when will we ever be free. when will ever have the right people in the right places Who among us will break the glass ceiling and set as free so that we can all fly to the top of our dreams. I think its time now we think otherwise, with this OLD BURGERS who kill our future in our very own eyes,we have no water,electricity,parking space, roads bcoz of them. The future of our unborn children is deaming by the day skunks think about this God help us On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd < kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs, using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
< http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ar...
"..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
< http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bc...
---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator?
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
I agree with Kiania, to bring down internet prices, we must go beyond bringing down individuals. Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring down prices. Instead we should be studying and looking at the conditions necessary to bring prices down. International fiber is definitely one of them. But as we have recently realized, it is NOT - in isolation - sufficient to cut down retail prices. walu. --- On Fri, 8/14/09, excuseme yespliz <xgetbusy@gmail.com> wrote:
From: excuseme yespliz <xgetbusy@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Fwd: the long fibre lie.... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: "Skunkworks forum" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Date: Friday, August 14, 2009, 1:47 PM @ David
I remember the ps at onetime in the news when he was cornered,he said he is responsible for the cable if it does not deliver he is putting his work on the line? so much money has been spend on this fiber optic ghost or rather cash cow and its we techies who will use it.
when we have better speeds will have more jobs,more comfort,less hustle as we can work from home virtually.quick downloads,and virtually travel round the world in the comfort of own environment.more jobs from all over the world. without ever leaving our living room. jeezz!!
This is what I was waiting for!!! But it seems things will never change The old gray hairs who by default own every big company and forever claim to be the youth,will never set as free.
first, all they do with internet is to download mail,which has taken some ages to understand how
secondly,they care less about the consumer and even the quality of service their companies offer are terrible They have no idea why we need better speeds.
My begging question is when will we ever be free.
when will ever have the right people in the right places Who among us will break the glass ceiling and set as free so that we can all fly to the top of our dreams.
I think its time now we think otherwise, with this OLD BURGERS who kill our future in our very own eyes,we have no water,electricity,parking space, roads bcoz of them.
The future of our unborn children is deaming by the day skunks think about this
God help us
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one
parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line
what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs,
using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't
we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be
forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM
Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices
do not drop as he promised!!
To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically
as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ardrz/-/index.html>
"...it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on
its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to
international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bcyoz/-/index.html>
---summary---
in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a
just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously
expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government
officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b)
demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue
living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have
"affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised
Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to
believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet
prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the
government and the regulator?
Alex
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--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no
matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon
_______________________________________________
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On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 2:11 PM, Walubengo J<jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Instead we should be studying and looking at the conditions necessary to bring prices down.
We are NOT paid to do think for government. We monitor if those paid to, actually do then we scream like fury when they don't then some when their "faulty thinking" leads to our continued exploitation. Moreover, TV footages and newspapers are awash with evidence of promises made. They deliver on promise or they go. Nothing personal against Ndemo, these are just facts.
Rhetorical question what does it take for us to have cheap/affordable power, water, food, cars, etc? Think of this in an environment where theres ni Govt to start with - and if you think having one is a solution then am not on the same page with you. On 14 Aug 2009, at 14:11, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
I agree with Kiania,
to bring down internet prices, we must go beyond bringing down individuals. Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring down prices.
Instead we should be studying and looking at the conditions necessary to bring prices down. International fiber is definitely one of them. But as we have recently realized, it is NOT - in isolation - sufficient to cut down retail prices.
walu.
--- On Fri, 8/14/09, excuseme yespliz <xgetbusy@gmail.com> wrote:
From: excuseme yespliz <xgetbusy@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Fwd: the long fibre lie.... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: "Skunkworks forum" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Date: Friday, August 14, 2009, 1:47 PM @ David
I remember the ps at onetime in the news when he was cornered,he said he is responsible for the cable if it does not deliver he is putting his work on the line? so much money has been spend on this fiber optic ghost or rather cash cow and its we techies who will use it.
when we have better speeds will have more jobs,more comfort,less hustle as we can work from home virtually.quick downloads,and virtually travel round the world in the comfort of own environment.more jobs from all over the world. without ever leaving our living room. jeezz!!
This is what I was waiting for!!! But it seems things will never change The old gray hairs who by default own every big company and forever claim to be the youth,will never set as free.
first, all they do with internet is to download mail,which has taken some ages to understand how
secondly,they care less about the consumer and even the quality of service their companies offer are terrible They have no idea why we need better speeds.
My begging question is when will we ever be free.
when will ever have the right people in the right places Who among us will break the glass ceiling and set as free so that we can all fly to the top of our dreams.
I think its time now we think otherwise, with this OLD BURGERS who kill our future in our very own eyes,we have no water,electricity,parking space, roads bcoz of them.
The future of our unborn children is deaming by the day skunks think about this
God help us
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one
parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line
what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs,
using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't
we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be
forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com
wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM
Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices
do not drop as he promised!!
To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically
as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ar...
"...it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on
its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to
international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bc...
---summary---
in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a
just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously
expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government
officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b)
demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue
living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have
"affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised
Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to
believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet
prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the
government and the regulator?
Alex
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list
Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke
Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Other lists
-------------
Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce
Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science
kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no
matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list
Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke
http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks
Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Other lists
-------------
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kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
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On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Michuki Mwangi<Michuki@swiftkenya.com> wrote:
Rhetorical question what does it take for us to have cheap/affordable power, water, food, cars, etc?
a "disturbingly" active,vocal and untiring Civil Society - ever after/if the Freedom of Information law one day gets enacted. Otherwise civil rights are taken away bit by bit by whoever the powers-that-be of the day.
Think of this in an environment where theres ni Govt to start with - and if you think having one is a solution then am not on the same page with you.
Is government a necessary evil? http://www.debate.org/debates/Government-is-a-necessary-evil-to-protect-the-... ( on the assumption that the government is functional)
On 14 Aug 2009, at 14:11, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring down prices.
I don't trust you and count me as diagonally opposed to the notion and interpretation that few self-private interest individuals qualify as "leading stakeholders" - unless according to you they mean more than 38+ million LEADING STAKEHOLDERS in Kenya. Who was it that once dubbed them "industry leaders" ?
hi all I think issues about price matrix are not what this issue is about (the market oscillation style)this we all know.and we need no lecture on it. even a bottle of beer we all know the recommended price but it depends with where you are taking it.and what the menu of that particular pub says.so you don't complain when paying the bill abit higher bcoz you are aware however, The ps was never forced to give false information,he had all the necessary dictionaries,techies from all so called market leaders to consult . If he had not mentioned about prices coming down nobody would be complaining on this one the fiber optic menu it says prices were to definitely come down and not on condition of this or that ....... in short The PS new what he was talking about and he knows where this grey hairs are targeting to imprison us. think about mobi-telea... they knew who they were,those who not apart of the deal blew the whistle but they still looted from us and now they are just a tale to talk about. my only worry is who will save us from being imprisoned and exploited while the rest of the world life is easier and better and faster.is it bcoz their no active CONSUMER ICT RIGHT GROUP here?who can boldly question the ICT ministry or organise a demostration? however before that , on this one bwana ps you have some clear explanation to do if not then stand up and say why not all we want is responsibility, if you said it, do it if you cannot there is 38+million burning with better and accurate ideas dying to willfully make it happen.if only given a chance. heaven come down on kenya !!!! On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 9:46 AM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Michuki Mwangi<Michuki@swiftkenya.com> wrote:
Rhetorical question what does it take for us to have cheap/affordable power, water, food, cars, etc?
a "disturbingly" active,vocal and untiring Civil Society - ever after/if the Freedom of Information law one day gets enacted. Otherwise civil rights are taken away bit by bit by whoever the powers-that-be of the day.
Think of this in an environment where theres ni Govt to start with - and if you think having one is a solution then am not on the same page with you.
Is government a necessary evil?
http://www.debate.org/debates/Government-is-a-necessary-evil-to-protect-the-... ( on the assumption that the government is functional)
On 14 Aug 2009, at 14:11, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring down prices.
I don't trust you and count me as diagonally opposed to the notion and interpretation that few self-private interest individuals qualify as "leading stakeholders" - unless according to you they mean more than 38+ million LEADING STAKEHOLDERS in Kenya. Who was it that once dubbed them "industry leaders" ? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
i agree with David,we should try and moderate the tones we use against each other.That is the only way people will be able to share freely and we will all work together to find solutions. When the KICTANET...started it was very good,all industry players use to contribute even MJ himself and the PS....a long the way people startted using language bordering on abuse....the kind of language am starting to see on this list. What happened? they pulled off the list.And there lots of people lots the opportunity to hear different views not from TECHIES alone. On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 9:29 PM, maina martin <martinafrique@gmail.com>wrote:
hi all
I think issues about price matrix are not what this issue is about (the market oscillation style)this we all know.and we need no lecture on it. even a bottle of beer we all know the recommended price but it depends with where you are taking it.and what the menu of that particular pub says.so you don't complain when paying the bill abit higher bcoz you are aware however, The ps was never forced to give false information,he had all the necessary dictionaries,techies from all so called market leaders to consult . If he had not mentioned about prices coming down nobody would be complaining
on this one the fiber optic menu it says prices were to definitely come down and not on condition of this or that .......
in short The PS new what he was talking about and he knows where this grey hairs are targeting to imprison us.
think about mobi-telea... they knew who they were,those who not apart of the deal blew the whistle but they still looted from us and now they are just a tale to talk about.
my only worry is who will save us from being imprisoned and exploited while the rest of the world life is easier and better and faster.is it bcoz their no active CONSUMER ICT RIGHT GROUP here?who can boldly question the ICT ministry or organise a demostration?
however before that , on this one bwana ps you have some clear explanation to do if not then stand up and say why not all we want is responsibility, if you said it, do it if you cannot there is 38+million burning with better and accurate ideas dying to willfully make it happen.if only given a chance.
heaven come down on kenya !!!!
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 9:46 AM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Michuki Mwangi<Michuki@swiftkenya.com> wrote:
Rhetorical question what does it take for us to have cheap/affordable power, water, food, cars, etc?
a "disturbingly" active,vocal and untiring Civil Society - ever after/if the Freedom of Information law one day gets enacted. Otherwise civil rights are taken away bit by bit by whoever the powers-that-be of the day.
Think of this in an environment where theres ni Govt to start with - and if you think having one is a solution then am not on the same page with you.
Is government a necessary evil?
http://www.debate.org/debates/Government-is-a-necessary-evil-to-protect-the-... ( on the assumption that the government is functional)
On 14 Aug 2009, at 14:11, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring down prices.
I don't trust you and count me as diagonally opposed to the notion and interpretation that few self-private interest individuals qualify as "leading stakeholders" - unless according to you they mean more than 38+ million LEADING STAKEHOLDERS in Kenya. Who was it that once dubbed them "industry leaders" ? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 2:10 PM, Joseph McDonald<mcdonaldoj@gmail.com> wrote:
i agree with David,we should try and moderate the tones we use against each other.That is the only way people will be able to share freely and we will all work together to find solutions.
Agreed and yes everybody's opinion matters-irrespective of how pro- or anti-establishment that might be. My online history proves that I respect this expression principle. However, "extraordinary situations call of extraordinary measures"- ask Speaker Marende. We should not confuse "calm" with "peace." I ask "How diplomatically can you convey the message here?" When it becomes clearer that infrastructure of continued telecommunications exploitation are being reinforced every day. i.e. what is the most diplomatic alternative word to "lie to" ?
When the KICTANET...started it was very good,all industry players use to contribute even MJ himself and the PS....a long the way people startted using language bordering on abuse....the kind of language am starting to see on this list.
Every online voice is equal- irrespective of who's it is whether MJ's, Bitange's, yours or mine- online democracy. Kictanet is but just one of my lists each driving/propelling different agenda. If any list member would respond to online post if only addressed like "your honour" "your highness" "your richness", "your learnedness", "your techniness" etc then heck I never want to know their "correct" opinions. I do not subscribe to the school that supposes that some opinion are "first-hand" other "second-hand"
What happened? they pulled off the list.And there lots of people lots the opportunity to hear different views not from TECHIES alone.
Let's focus on internet prices that were continually promised but apparently now will never be. Otherwise we risk confusing issues if not divert attention to the matter at hand.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 9:29 PM, maina martin <martinafrique@gmail.com> wrote:
hi all
I think issues about price matrix are not what this issue is about (the market oscillation style)this we all know.and we need no lecture on it. even a bottle of beer we all know the recommended price but it depends with where you are taking it.and what the menu of that particular pub says.so you don't complain when paying the bill abit higher bcoz you are aware however, The ps was never forced to give false information,he had all the necessary dictionaries,techies from all so called market leaders to consult . If he had not mentioned about prices coming down nobody would be complaining
on this one the fiber optic menu it says prices were to definitely come down and not on condition of this or that .......
in short The PS new what he was talking about and he knows where this grey hairs are targeting to imprison us.
think about mobi-telea... they knew who they were,those who not apart of the deal blew the whistle but they still looted from us and now they are just a tale to talk about.
my only worry is who will save us from being imprisoned and exploited while the rest of the world life is easier and better and faster.is it bcoz their no active CONSUMER ICT RIGHT GROUP here?who can boldly question the ICT ministry or organise a demostration?
however before that , on this one bwana ps you have some clear explanation to do if not then stand up and say why not all we want is responsibility, if you said it, do it if you cannot there is 38+million burning with better and accurate ideas dying to willfully make it happen.if only given a chance.
heaven come down on kenya !!!!
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 9:46 AM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Michuki Mwangi<Michuki@swiftkenya.com> wrote:
Rhetorical question what does it take for us to have cheap/affordable power, water, food, cars, etc?
a "disturbingly" active,vocal and untiring Civil Society - ever after/if the Freedom of Information law one day gets enacted. Otherwise civil rights are taken away bit by bit by whoever the powers-that-be of the day.
Think of this in an environment where theres ni Govt to start with - and if you think having one is a solution then am not on the same page with you.
Is government a necessary evil?
http://www.debate.org/debates/Government-is-a-necessary-evil-to-protect-the-... ( on the assumption that the government is functional)
On 14 Aug 2009, at 14:11, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring down prices.
I don't trust you and count me as diagonally opposed to the notion and interpretation that few self-private interest individuals qualify as "leading stakeholders" - unless according to you they mean more than 38+ million LEADING STAKEHOLDERS in Kenya. Who was it that once dubbed them "industry leaders" ? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Guys healthy debate here, we shouldnt take it at personal level though, much as i agree and fully support the strides that have been made in the industry under Dr Ndemo's watch some constructive criticism is also good so that we remain focused, Fibre is not an end in itself as the Media and majority of stakeholders have portrayed it is just a means to an end, our problem is cultural, Alex and Walu i am interested in knowing the possible socio-political impacts of the Fibre and possbile hindrances to its uptake, this is what might determine the drop in prices, remember the drop in Mobile phone call charges???, we might be channeling our energy in the wrong direction...me thinks On 8/15/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 2:10 PM, Joseph McDonald<mcdonaldoj@gmail.com> wrote:
i agree with David,we should try and moderate the tones we use against each other.That is the only way people will be able to share freely and we will all work together to find solutions.
Agreed and yes everybody's opinion matters-irrespective of how pro- or anti-establishment that might be. My online history proves that I respect this expression principle.
However, "extraordinary situations call of extraordinary measures"- ask Speaker Marende. We should not confuse "calm" with "peace." I ask "How diplomatically can you convey the message here?" When it becomes clearer that infrastructure of continued telecommunications exploitation are being reinforced every day. i.e. what is the most diplomatic alternative word to "lie to" ?
When the KICTANET...started it was very good,all industry players use to contribute even MJ himself and the PS....a long the way people startted using language bordering on abuse....the kind of language am starting to see on this list.
Every online voice is equal- irrespective of who's it is whether MJ's, Bitange's, yours or mine- online democracy. Kictanet is but just one of my lists each driving/propelling different agenda.
If any list member would respond to online post if only addressed like "your honour" "your highness" "your richness", "your learnedness", "your techniness" etc then heck I never want to know their "correct" opinions. I do not subscribe to the school that supposes that some opinion are "first-hand" other "second-hand"
What happened? they pulled off the list.And there lots of people lots the opportunity to hear different views not from TECHIES alone.
Let's focus on internet prices that were continually promised but apparently now will never be. Otherwise we risk confusing issues if not divert attention to the matter at hand.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 9:29 PM, maina martin <martinafrique@gmail.com> wrote:
hi all
I think issues about price matrix are not what this issue is about (the market oscillation style)this we all know.and we need no lecture on it. even a bottle of beer we all know the recommended price but it depends with where you are taking it.and what the menu of that particular pub says.so you don't complain when paying the bill abit higher bcoz you are aware however, The ps was never forced to give false information,he had all the necessary dictionaries,techies from all so called market leaders to consult . If he had not mentioned about prices coming down nobody would be complaining
on this one the fiber optic menu it says prices were to definitely come down and not on condition of this or that .......
in short The PS new what he was talking about and he knows where this grey hairs are targeting to imprison us.
think about mobi-telea... they knew who they were,those who not apart of the deal blew the whistle but they still looted from us and now they are just a tale to talk about.
my only worry is who will save us from being imprisoned and exploited while the rest of the world life is easier and better and faster.is it bcoz their no active CONSUMER ICT RIGHT GROUP here?who can boldly question the ICT ministry or organise a demostration?
however before that , on this one bwana ps you have some clear explanation to do if not then stand up and say why not all we want is responsibility, if you said it, do it if you cannot there is 38+million burning with better and accurate ideas dying to willfully make it happen.if only given a chance.
heaven come down on kenya !!!!
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 9:46 AM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Michuki Mwangi<Michuki@swiftkenya.com> wrote:
Rhetorical question what does it take for us to have cheap/affordable power, water, food, cars, etc?
a "disturbingly" active,vocal and untiring Civil Society - ever after/if the Freedom of Information law one day gets enacted. Otherwise civil rights are taken away bit by bit by whoever the powers-that-be of the day.
Think of this in an environment where theres ni Govt to start with - and if you think having one is a solution then am not on the same page with you.
Is government a necessary evil?
http://www.debate.org/debates/Government-is-a-necessary-evil-to-protect-the-... ( on the assumption that the government is functional)
On 14 Aug 2009, at 14:11, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring down prices.
I don't trust you and count me as diagonally opposed to the notion and interpretation that few self-private interest individuals qualify as "leading stakeholders" - unless according to you they mean more than 38+ million LEADING STAKEHOLDERS in Kenya. Who was it that once dubbed them "industry leaders" ? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- Barrack O. Otieno Administrative Manager Afriregister Ltd (Ke) P.o.Box 21682 Nairobi 00100 Tel: +254721325277 +254733206359 Riara Road, Bamboo Lane www.afriregister.com ICANN accredited registrar.
Barrack, "Louis Otieno Live" show of the week Speaker Marende ruled to chair House Business Committee would have been different. Paul Kukubo and I were meant to debate on the show; Paul representing government thus projecting all the wonderful things fibre would bring to kenya. I was to play the "Devils Advocate" and bring out all the negatives, such as prices under this thread, among many others looming. I truly regret that the show was canceled at the eleventh hour and how I was so prepared to rubbish many of the false promises made and raise awareness on unattended aspects... but how politics ever gets first priority here. Regards On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 1:57 PM, Barrack Otieno<otieno.barrack@gmail.com> wrote:
Guys healthy debate here, we shouldnt take it at personal level though, much as i agree and fully support the strides that have been made in the industry under Dr Ndemo's watch some constructive criticism is also good so that we remain focused, Fibre is not an end in itself as the Media and majority of stakeholders have portrayed it is just a means to an end, our problem is cultural, Alex and Walu i am interested in knowing the possible socio-political impacts of the Fibre and possbile hindrances to its uptake, this is what might determine the drop in prices, remember the drop in Mobile phone call charges???, we might be channeling our energy in the wrong direction...me thinks
On 8/15/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 2:10 PM, Joseph McDonald<mcdonaldoj@gmail.com> wrote:
i agree with David,we should try and moderate the tones we use against each other.That is the only way people will be able to share freely and we will all work together to find solutions.
Agreed and yes everybody's opinion matters-irrespective of how pro- or anti-establishment that might be. My online history proves that I respect this expression principle.
However, "extraordinary situations call of extraordinary measures"- ask Speaker Marende. We should not confuse "calm" with "peace." I ask "How diplomatically can you convey the message here?" When it becomes clearer that infrastructure of continued telecommunications exploitation are being reinforced every day. i.e. what is the most diplomatic alternative word to "lie to" ?
When the KICTANET...started it was very good,all industry players use to contribute even MJ himself and the PS....a long the way people startted using language bordering on abuse....the kind of language am starting to see on this list.
Every online voice is equal- irrespective of who's it is whether MJ's, Bitange's, yours or mine- online democracy. Kictanet is but just one of my lists each driving/propelling different agenda.
If any list member would respond to online post if only addressed like "your honour" "your highness" "your richness", "your learnedness", "your techniness" etc then heck I never want to know their "correct" opinions. I do not subscribe to the school that supposes that some opinion are "first-hand" other "second-hand"
What happened? they pulled off the list.And there lots of people lots the opportunity to hear different views not from TECHIES alone.
Let's focus on internet prices that were continually promised but apparently now will never be. Otherwise we risk confusing issues if not divert attention to the matter at hand.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 9:29 PM, maina martin <martinafrique@gmail.com> wrote:
hi all
I think issues about price matrix are not what this issue is about (the market oscillation style)this we all know.and we need no lecture on it. even a bottle of beer we all know the recommended price but it depends with where you are taking it.and what the menu of that particular pub says.so you don't complain when paying the bill abit higher bcoz you are aware however, The ps was never forced to give false information,he had all the necessary dictionaries,techies from all so called market leaders to consult . If he had not mentioned about prices coming down nobody would be complaining
on this one the fiber optic menu it says prices were to definitely come down and not on condition of this or that .......
in short The PS new what he was talking about and he knows where this grey hairs are targeting to imprison us.
think about mobi-telea... they knew who they were,those who not apart of the deal blew the whistle but they still looted from us and now they are just a tale to talk about.
my only worry is who will save us from being imprisoned and exploited while the rest of the world life is easier and better and faster.is it bcoz their no active CONSUMER ICT RIGHT GROUP here?who can boldly question the ICT ministry or organise a demostration?
however before that , on this one bwana ps you have some clear explanation to do if not then stand up and say why not all we want is responsibility, if you said it, do it if you cannot there is 38+million burning with better and accurate ideas dying to willfully make it happen.if only given a chance.
heaven come down on kenya !!!!
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 9:46 AM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Michuki Mwangi<Michuki@swiftkenya.com> wrote:
Rhetorical question what does it take for us to have cheap/affordable power, water, food, cars, etc?
a "disturbingly" active,vocal and untiring Civil Society - ever after/if the Freedom of Information law one day gets enacted. Otherwise civil rights are taken away bit by bit by whoever the powers-that-be of the day.
Think of this in an environment where theres ni Govt to start with - and if you think having one is a solution then am not on the same page with you.
Is government a necessary evil?
http://www.debate.org/debates/Government-is-a-necessary-evil-to-protect-the-... ( on the assumption that the government is functional)
On 14 Aug 2009, at 14:11, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai > (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring > down > prices.
I don't trust you and count me as diagonally opposed to the notion and interpretation that few self-private interest individuals qualify as "leading stakeholders" - unless according to you they mean more than 38+ million LEADING STAKEHOLDERS in Kenya. Who was it that once dubbed them "industry leaders" ? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- Barrack O. Otieno Administrative Manager Afriregister Ltd (Ke) P.o.Box 21682 Nairobi 00100 Tel: +254721325277 +254733206359 Riara Road, Bamboo Lane www.afriregister.com ICANN accredited registrar. _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Although I'm not in any way supporting personal besmirching and character assassination, I think Gakuru, you must have hit someone (read the Government and Corporates) below the belt, thus branded " a spoiler", however this should not deter proponents of fair competition to push for a change in Kenya's telecommunication industry. Overall, while we are talking about Vision 2030, there seems to be problem when it comes to implement it's achievement. I understand one of the core aspects of Vision 2030, is entrepreneurial development. I wonder how well we are going to breath if the trends continues! 2009/8/16 Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>
Barrack,
"Louis Otieno Live" show of the week Speaker Marende ruled to chair House Business Committee would have been different. Paul Kukubo and I were meant to debate on the show; Paul representing government thus projecting all the wonderful things fibre would bring to kenya. I was to play the "Devils Advocate" and bring out all the negatives, such as prices under this thread, among many others looming. I truly regret that the show was canceled at the eleventh hour and how I was so prepared to rubbish many of the false promises made and raise awareness on unattended aspects... but how politics ever gets first priority here.
Regards
Guys healthy debate here, we shouldnt take it at personal level though, much as i agree and fully support the strides that have been made in the industry under Dr Ndemo's watch some constructive criticism is also good so that we remain focused, Fibre is not an end in itself as the Media and majority of stakeholders have portrayed it is just a means to an end, our problem is cultural, Alex and Walu i am interested in knowing the possible socio-political impacts of the Fibre and possbile hindrances to its uptake, this is what might determine the drop in prices, remember the drop in Mobile phone call charges???, we might be channeling our energy in the wrong direction...me thinks
On 8/15/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 2:10 PM, Joseph McDonald<mcdonaldoj@gmail.com> wrote:
i agree with David,we should try and moderate the tones we use against each other.That is the only way people will be able to share freely and we will all work together to find solutions.
Agreed and yes everybody's opinion matters-irrespective of how pro- or anti-establishment that might be. My online history proves that I respect this expression principle.
However, "extraordinary situations call of extraordinary measures"- ask Speaker Marende. We should not confuse "calm" with "peace." I ask "How diplomatically can you convey the message here?" When it becomes clearer that infrastructure of continued telecommunications exploitation are being reinforced every day. i.e. what is the most diplomatic alternative word to "lie to" ?
When the KICTANET...started it was very good,all industry players use to contribute even MJ himself and the PS....a long the way people startted using language bordering on abuse....the kind of language am starting to see on this list.
Every online voice is equal- irrespective of who's it is whether MJ's, Bitange's, yours or mine- online democracy. Kictanet is but just one of my lists each driving/propelling different agenda.
If any list member would respond to online post if only addressed like "your honour" "your highness" "your richness", "your learnedness", "your techniness" etc then heck I never want to know their "correct" opinions. I do not subscribe to the school that supposes that some opinion are "first-hand" other "second-hand"
What happened? they pulled off the list.And there lots of people lots the opportunity to hear different views not from TECHIES alone.
Let's focus on internet prices that were continually promised but apparently now will never be. Otherwise we risk confusing issues if not divert attention to the matter at hand.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 9:29 PM, maina martin <martinafrique@gmail.com
wrote:
hi all
I think issues about price matrix are not what this issue is about
(the
market oscillation style)this we all know.and we need no lecture on it. even a bottle of beer we all know the recommended price but it depends with where you are taking it.and what the menu of that particular pub says.so you don't complain when paying the bill abit higher bcoz you are aware however, The ps was never forced to give false information,he had all the necessary dictionaries,techies from all so called market leaders to consult . If he had not mentioned about prices coming down nobody would be complaining
on this one the fiber optic menu it says prices were to definitely come down and not on condition of this or that .......
in short The PS new what he was talking about and he knows where this grey hairs are targeting to imprison us.
think about mobi-telea... they knew who they were,those who not apart of the deal blew the whistle but they still looted from us and now they are just a tale to talk about.
my only worry is who will save us from being imprisoned and exploited while the rest of the world life is easier and better and faster.isit bcoz their no active CONSUMER ICT RIGHT GROUP here?who can boldly question the ICT ministry or organise a demostration?
however before that , on this one bwana ps you have some clear explanation to do if not then stand up and say why not all we want is responsibility, if you said it, do it if you cannot there is 38+million burning with better and accurate ideas dying to willfully make it happen.if only given a chance.
heaven come down on kenya !!!!
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 9:46 AM, Gakuru Alex < alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Michuki Mwangi<
Michuki@swiftkenya.com>
wrote: > Rhetorical question what does it take for us to have cheap/affordable > power, > water, food, cars, etc?
a "disturbingly" active,vocal and untiring Civil Society - ever after/if the Freedom of Information law one day gets enacted. Otherwise civil rights are taken away bit by bit by whoever the powers-that-be of the day.
> Think of this in an environment where theres ni Govt to start with
On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 1:57 PM, Barrack Otieno<otieno.barrack@gmail.com> wrote: -
> and if > you think having one is a solution then am not on the same page with > you. > Is government a necessary evil?
http://www.debate.org/debates/Government-is-a-necessary-evil-to-protect-the-...
( on the assumption that the government is functional) > > On 14 Aug 2009, at 14:11, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai >> (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring >> down >> prices.
I don't trust you and count me as diagonally opposed to the notion and interpretation that few self-private interest individuals qualify as "leading stakeholders" - unless according to you they mean more than 38+ million LEADING STAKEHOLDERS in Kenya. Who was it that once dubbed them "industry leaders" ? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- Barrack O. Otieno Administrative Manager Afriregister Ltd (Ke) P.o.Box 21682 Nairobi 00100 Tel: +254721325277 +254733206359 Riara Road, Bamboo Lane www.afriregister.com ICANN accredited registrar. _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- Solomon Mburu P.O. Box 19343 - 00202 Nairobi Cell: (+254-0) 735 431041 Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill! AND It is better to die in dignity than in the ignomity of ambiguous generosity! Sent from Nairobi, Kenya
I hope the show takes off Final Alex, he who knows how is always at the mercy of he who knows why?, we need to answer the question Why Fibre comprehensively, i would love to get Paul Kukubos opinion on this list, i hope Protocol permits :-) On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 2:32 PM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>wrote:
Barrack,
"Louis Otieno Live" show of the week Speaker Marende ruled to chair House Business Committee would have been different. Paul Kukubo and I were meant to debate on the show; Paul representing government thus projecting all the wonderful things fibre would bring to kenya. I was to play the "Devils Advocate" and bring out all the negatives, such as prices under this thread, among many others looming. I truly regret that the show was canceled at the eleventh hour and how I was so prepared to rubbish many of the false promises made and raise awareness on unattended aspects... but how politics ever gets first priority here.
Regards
Guys healthy debate here, we shouldnt take it at personal level though, much as i agree and fully support the strides that have been made in the industry under Dr Ndemo's watch some constructive criticism is also good so that we remain focused, Fibre is not an end in itself as the Media and majority of stakeholders have portrayed it is just a means to an end, our problem is cultural, Alex and Walu i am interested in knowing the possible socio-political impacts of the Fibre and possbile hindrances to its uptake, this is what might determine the drop in prices, remember the drop in Mobile phone call charges???, we might be channeling our energy in the wrong direction...me thinks
On 8/15/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 2:10 PM, Joseph McDonald<mcdonaldoj@gmail.com> wrote:
i agree with David,we should try and moderate the tones we use against each other.That is the only way people will be able to share freely and we will all work together to find solutions.
Agreed and yes everybody's opinion matters-irrespective of how pro- or anti-establishment that might be. My online history proves that I respect this expression principle.
However, "extraordinary situations call of extraordinary measures"- ask Speaker Marende. We should not confuse "calm" with "peace." I ask "How diplomatically can you convey the message here?" When it becomes clearer that infrastructure of continued telecommunications exploitation are being reinforced every day. i.e. what is the most diplomatic alternative word to "lie to" ?
When the KICTANET...started it was very good,all industry players use to contribute even MJ himself and the PS....a long the way people startted using language bordering on abuse....the kind of language am starting to see on this list.
Every online voice is equal- irrespective of who's it is whether MJ's, Bitange's, yours or mine- online democracy. Kictanet is but just one of my lists each driving/propelling different agenda.
If any list member would respond to online post if only addressed like "your honour" "your highness" "your richness", "your learnedness", "your techniness" etc then heck I never want to know their "correct" opinions. I do not subscribe to the school that supposes that some opinion are "first-hand" other "second-hand"
What happened? they pulled off the list.And there lots of people lots the opportunity to hear different views not from TECHIES alone.
Let's focus on internet prices that were continually promised but apparently now will never be. Otherwise we risk confusing issues if not divert attention to the matter at hand.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 9:29 PM, maina martin <martinafrique@gmail.com
wrote:
hi all
I think issues about price matrix are not what this issue is about
(the
market oscillation style)this we all know.and we need no lecture on it. even a bottle of beer we all know the recommended price but it depends with where you are taking it.and what the menu of that particular pub says.so you don't complain when paying the bill abit higher bcoz you are aware however, The ps was never forced to give false information,he had all the necessary dictionaries,techies from all so called market leaders to consult . If he had not mentioned about prices coming down nobody would be complaining
on this one the fiber optic menu it says prices were to definitely come down and not on condition of this or that .......
in short The PS new what he was talking about and he knows where this grey hairs are targeting to imprison us.
think about mobi-telea... they knew who they were,those who not apart of the deal blew the whistle but they still looted from us and now they are just a tale to talk about.
my only worry is who will save us from being imprisoned and exploited while the rest of the world life is easier and better and faster.isit bcoz their no active CONSUMER ICT RIGHT GROUP here?who can boldly question the ICT ministry or organise a demostration?
however before that , on this one bwana ps you have some clear explanation to do if not then stand up and say why not all we want is responsibility, if you said it, do it if you cannot there is 38+million burning with better and accurate ideas dying to willfully make it happen.if only given a chance.
heaven come down on kenya !!!!
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 9:46 AM, Gakuru Alex < alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Michuki Mwangi<
Michuki@swiftkenya.com>
wrote: > Rhetorical question what does it take for us to have cheap/affordable > power, > water, food, cars, etc?
a "disturbingly" active,vocal and untiring Civil Society - ever after/if the Freedom of Information law one day gets enacted. Otherwise civil rights are taken away bit by bit by whoever the powers-that-be of the day.
> Think of this in an environment where theres ni Govt to start with
On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 1:57 PM, Barrack Otieno<otieno.barrack@gmail.com> wrote: -
> and if > you think having one is a solution then am not on the same page with > you. > Is government a necessary evil?
http://www.debate.org/debates/Government-is-a-necessary-evil-to-protect-the-...
( on the assumption that the government is functional) > > On 14 Aug 2009, at 14:11, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai >> (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring >> down >> prices.
I don't trust you and count me as diagonally opposed to the notion and interpretation that few self-private interest individuals qualify as "leading stakeholders" - unless according to you they mean more than 38+ million LEADING STAKEHOLDERS in Kenya. Who was it that once dubbed them "industry leaders" ? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- Barrack O. Otieno Administrative Manager Afriregister Ltd (Ke) P.o.Box 21682 Nairobi 00100 Tel: +254721325277 +254733206359 Riara Road, Bamboo Lane www.afriregister.com ICANN accredited registrar. _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- Barrack O. Otieno Administrative Manager Afriregister Ltd (Ke) P.o.Box 21682 Nairobi 00100 Tel: +254721325277 +254733206359 Riara Road, Bamboo Lane www.afriregister.com ICANN accredited registrar.
Barrack Kukubo will never get to answer anything about the above because of his knowledge which is limited to marketing and his power at ICT board which is limited by his deputy who apparently is using unorthodox methods including evn forcing senior government officials to do the unthinkable to get ICT Board favours. Kukubo has never competently answered anything about the fibre and event the country's ICT vision which is funnily also pegged on Vision 2030. We also heard Kukubo and Ndemo brag last that Vision 2030 and Kenya ICT Act 2008 were all mostly copy pasted from South African same. Now thats whom you want to competently answer on the country's ICT Vision? Lets be serious MO On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 11:23 AM, Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com>wrote:
I hope the show takes off Final Alex, he who knows how is always at the mercy of he who knows why?, we need to answer the question Why Fibre comprehensively, i would love to get Paul Kukubos opinion on this list, i hope Protocol permits :-)
On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 2:32 PM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>wrote:
Barrack,
"Louis Otieno Live" show of the week Speaker Marende ruled to chair House Business Committee would have been different. Paul Kukubo and I were meant to debate on the show; Paul representing government thus projecting all the wonderful things fibre would bring to kenya. I was to play the "Devils Advocate" and bring out all the negatives, such as prices under this thread, among many others looming. I truly regret that the show was canceled at the eleventh hour and how I was so prepared to rubbish many of the false promises made and raise awareness on unattended aspects... but how politics ever gets first priority here.
Regards
Guys healthy debate here, we shouldnt take it at personal level though, much as i agree and fully support the strides that have been made in the industry under Dr Ndemo's watch some constructive criticism is also good so that we remain focused, Fibre is not an end in itself as the Media and majority of stakeholders have portrayed it is just a means to an end, our problem is cultural, Alex and Walu i am interested in knowing the possible socio-political impacts of the Fibre and possbile hindrances to its uptake, this is what might determine the drop in prices, remember the drop in Mobile phone call charges???, we might be channeling our energy in the wrong direction...me thinks
On 8/15/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 2:10 PM, Joseph McDonald<mcdonaldoj@gmail.com> wrote:
i agree with David,we should try and moderate the tones we use against each other.That is the only way people will be able to share freely and we will all work together to find solutions.
Agreed and yes everybody's opinion matters-irrespective of how pro- or anti-establishment that might be. My online history proves that I respect this expression principle.
However, "extraordinary situations call of extraordinary measures"- ask Speaker Marende. We should not confuse "calm" with "peace." I ask "How diplomatically can you convey the message here?" When it becomes clearer that infrastructure of continued telecommunications exploitation are being reinforced every day. i.e. what is the most diplomatic alternative word to "lie to" ?
When the KICTANET...started it was very good,all industry players use to contribute even MJ himself and the PS....a long the way people startted using language bordering on abuse....the kind of language am starting to see on this list.
Every online voice is equal- irrespective of who's it is whether MJ's, Bitange's, yours or mine- online democracy. Kictanet is but just one of my lists each driving/propelling different agenda.
If any list member would respond to online post if only addressed like "your honour" "your highness" "your richness", "your learnedness", "your techniness" etc then heck I never want to know their "correct" opinions. I do not subscribe to the school that supposes that some opinion are "first-hand" other "second-hand"
What happened? they pulled off the list.And there lots of people lots the opportunity to hear different views not from TECHIES alone.
Let's focus on internet prices that were continually promised but apparently now will never be. Otherwise we risk confusing issues if not divert attention to the matter at hand.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 9:29 PM, maina martin < martinafrique@gmail.com> wrote:
hi all
I think issues about price matrix are not what this issue is about
(the
market oscillation style)this we all know.and we need no lecture on it. even a bottle of beer we all know the recommended price but it depends with where you are taking it.and what the menu of that particular pub says.so you don't complain when paying the bill abit higher bcoz you are aware however, The ps was never forced to give false information,he had all the necessary dictionaries,techies from all so called market leaders to consult . If he had not mentioned about prices coming down nobody would be complaining
on this one the fiber optic menu it says prices were to definitely come down and not on condition of this or that .......
in short The PS new what he was talking about and he knows where this grey hairs are targeting to imprison us.
think about mobi-telea... they knew who they were,those who not apart of the deal blew the whistle but they still looted from us and now they are just a tale to talk about.
my only worry is who will save us from being imprisoned and exploited while the rest of the world life is easier and better and faster.isit bcoz their no active CONSUMER ICT RIGHT GROUP here?who can boldly question the ICT ministry or organise a demostration?
however before that , on this one bwana ps you have some clear explanation to do if not then stand up and say why not all we want is responsibility, if you said it, do it if you cannot there is 38+million burning with better and accurate ideas dying to willfully make it happen.if only given a chance.
heaven come down on kenya !!!!
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 9:46 AM, Gakuru Alex < alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote: > > On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Michuki Mwangi< Michuki@swiftkenya.com> > wrote: > > Rhetorical question what does it take for us to have cheap/affordable > > power, > > water, food, cars, etc? > > a "disturbingly" active,vocal and untiring Civil Society - ever > after/if the Freedom of Information law one day gets enacted. > Otherwise civil rights are taken away bit by bit by whoever the > powers-that-be of the day. > > > Think of this in an environment where theres ni Govt to start with
On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 1:57 PM, Barrack Otieno<otieno.barrack@gmail.com> wrote: -
> > and if > > you think having one is a solution then am not on the same page with > > you. > > > Is government a necessary evil? > > http://www.debate.org/debates/Government-is-a-necessary-evil-to-protect-the-... > ( on the assumption that the government is functional) > > > > On 14 Aug 2009, at 14:11, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote: > > >> Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai > >> (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring > >> down > >> prices. > > I don't trust you and count me as diagonally opposed to the notion and > interpretation that few self-private interest individuals qualify as > "leading stakeholders" - unless according to you they mean more than > 38+ million LEADING STAKEHOLDERS in Kenya. Who was it that once dubbed > them "industry leaders" ? > _______________________________________________ > Skunkworks mailing list > Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke > http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks > Other services @ http://my.co.ke > Other lists > ------------- > Announce: > http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce > Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science > kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- Barrack O. Otieno Administrative Manager Afriregister Ltd (Ke) P.o.Box 21682 Nairobi 00100 Tel: +254721325277 +254733206359 Riara Road, Bamboo Lane www.afriregister.com ICANN accredited registrar. _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- Barrack O. Otieno Administrative Manager Afriregister Ltd (Ke) P.o.Box 21682 Nairobi 00100 Tel: +254721325277 +254733206359 Riara Road, Bamboo Lane www.afriregister.com ICANN accredited registrar.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Well Mike, lets be a bit tolerant with each other and make the debate more objective in a few words what is the way forward then?? Alex a ten point plan that can bring good closure to this debate? On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 11:28 AM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
Barrack Kukubo will never get to answer anything about the above because of his knowledge which is limited to marketing and his power at ICT board which is limited by his deputy who apparently is using unorthodox methods including evn forcing senior government officials to do the unthinkable to get ICT Board favours.
Kukubo has never competently answered anything about the fibre and event the country's ICT vision which is funnily also pegged on Vision 2030. We also heard Kukubo and Ndemo brag last that Vision 2030 and Kenya ICT Act 2008 were all mostly copy pasted from South African same.
Now thats whom you want to competently answer on the country's ICT Vision? Lets be serious
MO
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 11:23 AM, Barrack Otieno <otieno.barrack@gmail.com
wrote:
I hope the show takes off Final Alex, he who knows how is always at the mercy of he who knows why?, we need to answer the question Why Fibre comprehensively, i would love to get Paul Kukubos opinion on this list, i hope Protocol permits :-)
On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 2:32 PM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>wrote:
Barrack,
"Louis Otieno Live" show of the week Speaker Marende ruled to chair House Business Committee would have been different. Paul Kukubo and I were meant to debate on the show; Paul representing government thus projecting all the wonderful things fibre would bring to kenya. I was to play the "Devils Advocate" and bring out all the negatives, such as prices under this thread, among many others looming. I truly regret that the show was canceled at the eleventh hour and how I was so prepared to rubbish many of the false promises made and raise awareness on unattended aspects... but how politics ever gets first priority here.
Regards
On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 1:57 PM, Barrack Otieno<otieno.barrack@gmail.com> wrote:
Guys healthy debate here, we shouldnt take it at personal level though, much as i agree and fully support the strides that have been made in the industry under Dr Ndemo's watch some constructive criticism is also good so that we remain focused, Fibre is not an end in itself as the Media and majority of stakeholders have portrayed it is just a means to an end, our problem is cultural, Alex and Walu i am interested in knowing the possible socio-political impacts of the Fibre and possbile hindrances to its uptake, this is what might determine the drop in prices, remember the drop in Mobile phone call charges???, we might be channeling our energy in the wrong direction...me thinks
On 8/15/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 2:10 PM, Joseph McDonald<mcdonaldoj@gmail.com
wrote:
i agree with David,we should try and moderate the tones we use against each other.That is the only way people will be able to share freely and we will all work together to find solutions.
Agreed and yes everybody's opinion matters-irrespective of how pro- or anti-establishment that might be. My online history proves that I respect this expression principle.
However, "extraordinary situations call of extraordinary measures"- ask Speaker Marende. We should not confuse "calm" with "peace." I ask "How diplomatically can you convey the message here?" When it becomes clearer that infrastructure of continued telecommunications exploitation are being reinforced every day. i.e. what is the most diplomatic alternative word to "lie to" ?
When the KICTANET...started it was very good,all industry players use to contribute even MJ himself and the PS....a long the way people startted using language bordering on abuse....the kind of language am starting to see on this list.
Every online voice is equal- irrespective of who's it is whether MJ's, Bitange's, yours or mine- online democracy. Kictanet is but just one of my lists each driving/propelling different agenda.
If any list member would respond to online post if only addressed like "your honour" "your highness" "your richness", "your learnedness", "your techniness" etc then heck I never want to know their "correct" opinions. I do not subscribe to the school that supposes that some opinion are "first-hand" other "second-hand"
What happened? they pulled off the list.And there lots of people lots the opportunity to hear different views not from TECHIES alone.
Let's focus on internet prices that were continually promised but apparently now will never be. Otherwise we risk confusing issues if not divert attention to the matter at hand.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 9:29 PM, maina martin < martinafrique@gmail.com> wrote: > > hi all > > I think issues about price matrix are not what this issue is about (the > market oscillation style)this we all know.and we need no lecture on it. > even a bottle of beer we all know the recommended price but it depends > with where you are taking it.and what the menu of that particular pub > says.so you don't complain when paying the bill abit higher bcoz you are > aware > however, > The ps was never forced to give false information,he had all the > necessary > dictionaries,techies from all so called market leaders to consult . > If he had not mentioned about prices coming down nobody would be > complaining > > on this one the fiber optic menu it says prices were to definitely come > down and not on condition of this or that ....... > > in short The PS new what he was talking about and he knows where this > grey > hairs are targeting to imprison us. > > think about mobi-telea... they knew who they were,those who not apart of > the deal blew the whistle but they still looted from us and now they are > just a tale to talk about. > > my only worry is who will save us from being imprisoned and exploited > while the rest of the world life is easier and better and faster.is it > bcoz > their no active CONSUMER ICT RIGHT GROUP here?who can boldly question the > ICT ministry or organise a demostration? > > however before that , > on this one bwana ps you have some clear explanation to do if not then > stand up and say why not > all we want is responsibility, > if you said it, > do it > if you cannot > there is 38+million burning with better and accurate ideas dying to > willfully make it happen.if only given a chance. > > heaven come down on kenya !!!! > > > On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 9:46 AM, Gakuru Alex < alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> > wrote: >> >> On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 7:52 AM, Michuki Mwangi< Michuki@swiftkenya.com> >> wrote: >> > Rhetorical question what does it take for us to have cheap/affordable >> > power, >> > water, food, cars, etc? >> >> a "disturbingly" active,vocal and untiring Civil Society - ever >> after/if the Freedom of Information law one day gets enacted. >> Otherwise civil rights are taken away bit by bit by whoever the >> powers-that-be of the day. >> >> > Think of this in an environment where theres ni Govt to start with - >> > and if >> > you think having one is a solution then am not on the same page with >> > you. >> > >> Is government a necessary evil? >> >> http://www.debate.org/debates/Government-is-a-necessary-evil-to-protect-the-... >> ( on the assumption that the government is functional) >> > >> > On 14 Aug 2009, at 14:11, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> >> Trust me, replacing Ndemo (Govt), Michael J($afcom) or Kai >> >> (KDN) just to name a few of the leading stakeholders will NOT bring >> >> down >> >> prices. >> >> I don't trust you and count me as diagonally opposed to the notion and >> interpretation that few self-private interest individuals qualify as >> "leading stakeholders" - unless according to you they mean more than >> 38+ million LEADING STAKEHOLDERS in Kenya. Who was it that once dubbed >> them "industry leaders" ? >> _______________________________________________ >> Skunkworks mailing list >> Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke >> http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks >> Other services @ http://my.co.ke >> Other lists >> ------------- >> Announce: >> http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce >> Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science >> kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general > > > _______________________________________________ > Skunkworks mailing list > Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke > http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks > Other services @ http://my.co.ke > Other lists > ------------- > Announce: > http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce > Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science > kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
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-- Barrack O. Otieno Administrative Manager Afriregister Ltd (Ke) P.o.Box 21682 Nairobi 00100 Tel: +254721325277 +254733206359 Riara Road, Bamboo Lane www.afriregister.com ICANN accredited registrar.
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-- Barrack O. Otieno Administrative Manager Afriregister Ltd (Ke) P.o.Box 21682 Nairobi 00100 Tel: +254721325277 +254733206359 Riara Road, Bamboo Lane www.afriregister.com ICANN accredited registrar.
Unfortunately, I learned that the government has spies everywhere [even here [?] ] And not to forget that they are the gate-keepers of almost everything. My suggestion - keep a low profile until you reach that TV program or Public exposure. Because then, no one really knows which sentiments you will broadcast... Just my opinion.
Stephen Watakuwa na Spies kushinda Kibaki. Its very easy to penetrate and tell them off. So easy to tell them even if they dont want to listen Boniface Mwangi did organise the tellingoff of the President in full glare. Bunge la Mwananchi does that all the time MO On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 1:05 PM, ndungu stephen <ndungustephen@gmail.com>wrote:
Unfortunately,
I learned that the government has spies everywhere [even here [?] ]
And not to forget that they are the gate-keepers of almost everything.
My suggestion - keep a low profile until you reach that TV program or Public exposure.
Because then, no one really knows which sentiments you will broadcast...
Just my opinion.
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@David, I am typing this very far from where I work - because my internet connection, once again, automagically 'developed technical problems' immediately after i posted that message. Frankly, I am not sorry even for a single letter on that email.Eenough is enough! Alex On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs, using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ardrz/-/index.html>
"..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bcyoz/-/index.html>
---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator?
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
@Y'alll Let's blame Ndemo even for the Linksys router that's not working well. I am totally opposed to this "Mob Justice" approach to issues. We generate plenty of heat and light and thereafter you still starring at the same problems, Nothing's been done. Kiania On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 2:52 PM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
@David,
I am typing this very far from where I work - because my internet connection, once again, automagically 'developed technical problems' immediately after i posted that message.
Frankly, I am not sorry even for a single letter on that email.Eenough is enough!
Alex
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs, using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ardrz/-/index.html>
"..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bcyoz/-/index.html>
---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator?
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- [Asentric Consulting Ltd] If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth .... -Richest Man in Babylon
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:10 PM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
@Y'alll Let's blame Ndemo even for the Linksys router that's not working well. I am totally opposed to this "Mob Justice" approach to issues. We
I hear you David. BR, S
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:10 PM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
@Y'alll Let's blame Ndemo even for the Linksys router that's not working well.
hmmm!
I am totally opposed to this "Mob Justice" approach to issues. We generate plenty of heat and light and thereafter you still starring at the same problems, Nothing's been done.
Suggesting we continue with the historical 'normal' apathy ?
Kiania
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 2:52 PM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
@David,
I am typing this very far from where I work - because my internet connection, once again, automagically 'developed technical problems' immediately after i posted that message.
Frankly, I am not sorry even for a single letter on that email.Eenough is enough!
Alex
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs, using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ardrz/-/index.html>
"..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
<http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bcyoz/-/index.html>
---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator?
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Gakuru, totaly agree with you.Kiania, what do you suggest should be done? On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:29 PM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:10 PM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
@Y'alll Let's blame Ndemo even for the Linksys router that's not working well.
hmmm!
I am totally opposed to this "Mob Justice" approach to issues. We generate plenty of heat and light and thereafter you still starring at the same problems, Nothing's been done.
Suggesting we continue with the historical 'normal' apathy ?
Kiania
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 2:52 PM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
@David,
I am typing this very far from where I work - because my internet connection, once again, automagically 'developed technical problems' immediately after i posted that message.
Frankly, I am not sorry even for a single letter on that email.Eenough is enough!
Alex
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs, using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex< alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
< http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ar...
"..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
<
http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bc...
---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator?
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce:
http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce
Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- Regards, Muniu Kariuki | T: +254 720 813 525 | E: dennis.muniu@gmail.com | Twitter: muniu | Skype: muniu_k |
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Muniu Kariuki<dennis.muniu@gmail.com> wrote:
Gakuru, totaly agree with you.Kiania, what do you suggest should be done?
<sarcasm> introduce price controls? </sarcasm> BR, S
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Muniu Kariuki<dennis.muniu@gmail.com> wrote:
Gakuru, totaly agree with you.Kiania, what do you suggest should be done?
I think Gakuru is right. If PS Ndemo promised that prices would drop, he was doing that from a "know it" stand point. He knew how they would. The question is "when" should they be coming down? Did he also give an indication of when, or at what point? That way we can go back to him and ask why things are not happening. Gakuru is representing those consumers who are asking the same questions:-) -- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
Many providers are still waiting for their Satellite contracts to expire :( 2009/8/14 Odhiambo ワシントン <odhiambo@gmail.com>
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Muniu Kariuki<dennis.muniu@gmail.com> wrote:
Gakuru, totaly agree with you.Kiania, what do you suggest should be done?
I think Gakuru is right. If PS Ndemo promised that prices would drop, he was doing that from a "know it" stand point. He knew how they would. The question is "when" should they be coming down? Did he also give an indication of when, or at what point? That way we can go back to him and ask why things are not happening. Gakuru is representing those consumers who are asking the same questions:-)
-- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- With Regards, Phares Kariuki | T: +254 734 810 802 | E: pkariuki@gmail.com | Twitter: kaboro | Skype: kariukiphares |
2009/8/14 Odhiambo ワシントン <odhiambo@gmail.com>:
I think Gakuru is right. If PS Ndemo promised that prices would drop, he was doing that from a "know it" stand point. He knew how they would. The question is "when" should they be coming down? Did he also give an indication of when, or at what point? That way we can go back to him and ask why things are not happening. Gakuru is representing those consumers who are asking the same questions:-)
That I agree with, Gakuru's asking valid questions. BR, S
It even sounds ludicrous ... Have prices come down? the answer is YES! is it to the satisfaction of people NO! Should Ndemo resign because the prices haven't come down to your satisfaction? let's be serious. We buy capacity from ISPs and not from the ICT Ministry, if we have a problem we pick it with them and not government, or are we looking for razzmatazz?? We should pressure Safaricom, KDN, Access and the rest to push their prices lower. Gakuru et al, are we assured of lower prices should he step down? Kiania 2009/8/14 Odhiambo ワシントン <odhiambo@gmail.com>:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Muniu Kariuki<dennis.muniu@gmail.com> wrote:
Gakuru, totaly agree with you.Kiania, what do you suggest should be done?
I think Gakuru is right. If PS Ndemo promised that prices would drop, he was doing that from a "know it" stand point. He knew how they would. The question is "when" should they be coming down? Did he also give an indication of when, or at what point? That way we can go back to him and ask why things are not happening. Gakuru is representing those consumers who are asking the same questions:-)
-- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- [Asentric Consulting Ltd] If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth .... -Richest Man in Babylon
Some big guys say things then when cornered, they come out burning with rage claiming to have been misquoted. If Dr. Ndemo is reading this, then he ought to clearly tell us the cost of internet will drop by midnight of this Friday. Gakuru is just playing a watchdog role and so, it should be fully supported. We are tired of these corporate lies! On 14/08/2009, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
It even sounds ludicrous ... Have prices come down? the answer is YES! is it to the satisfaction of people NO! Should Ndemo resign because the prices haven't come down to your satisfaction? let's be serious.
We buy capacity from ISPs and not from the ICT Ministry, if we have a problem we pick it with them and not government, or are we looking for razzmatazz?? We should pressure Safaricom, KDN, Access and the rest to push their prices lower. Gakuru et al, are we assured of lower prices should he step down?
Kiania
2009/8/14 Odhiambo ワシントン <odhiambo@gmail.com>:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Muniu Kariuki<dennis.muniu@gmail.com> wrote:
Gakuru, totaly agree with you.Kiania, what do you suggest should be done?
I think Gakuru is right. If PS Ndemo promised that prices would drop, he was doing that from a "know it" stand point. He knew how they would. The question is "when" should they be coming down? Did he also give an indication of when, or at what point? That way we can go back to him and ask why things are not happening. Gakuru is representing those consumers who are asking the same questions:-)
-- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- Solomon Mburu P.O. Box 19343 - 00202 Nairobi Cell: (+254-0) 735 431041 Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill! AND It is better to die in dignity than in the ignomity of ambiguous generosity!
Some big guys say things then when cornered, they come out burning with rage claiming to have been misquoted. If Dr. Ndemo is reading this, then he ought to clearly tell us the cost of internet will drop by midnight of this Friday. Gakuru is just playing a watchdog role and so, it should be fully supported. We are tired of these corporate lies! On 14/08/2009, Solomon Mburu <solo.mburu@gmail.com> wrote:
Some big guys say things then when cornered, they come out burning with rage claiming to have been misquoted. If Dr. Ndemo is reading this, then he ought to clearly tell us the cost of internet will drop by midnight of this Friday. Gakuru is just playing a watchdog role and so, it should be fully supported. We are tired of these corporate lies!
On 14/08/2009, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
It even sounds ludicrous ... Have prices come down? the answer is YES! is it to the satisfaction of people NO! Should Ndemo resign because the prices haven't come down to your satisfaction? let's be serious.
We buy capacity from ISPs and not from the ICT Ministry, if we have a problem we pick it with them and not government, or are we looking for razzmatazz?? We should pressure Safaricom, KDN, Access and the rest to push their prices lower. Gakuru et al, are we assured of lower prices should he step down?
Kiania
2009/8/14 Odhiambo ワシントン <odhiambo@gmail.com>:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Muniu Kariuki<dennis.muniu@gmail.com> wrote:
Gakuru, totaly agree with you.Kiania, what do you suggest should be done?
I think Gakuru is right. If PS Ndemo promised that prices would drop, he was doing that from a "know it" stand point. He knew how they would. The question is "when" should they be coming down? Did he also give an indication of when, or at what point? That way we can go back to him and ask why things are not happening. Gakuru is representing those consumers who are asking the same questions:-)
-- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- Solomon Mburu P.O. Box 19343 - 00202 Nairobi Cell: (+254-0) 735 431041
Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill!
AND
It is better to die in dignity than in the ignomity of ambiguous generosity!
-- Solomon Mburu P.O. Box 19343 - 00202 Nairobi Cell: (+254-0) 735 431041 Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill! AND It is better to die in dignity than in the ignomity of ambiguous generosity!
2009/8/14 David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com>
It even sounds ludicrous ... Have prices come down? the answer is YES! is it to the satisfaction of people NO! Should Ndemo resign because the prices haven't come down to your satisfaction? let's be serious.
We buy capacity from ISPs and not from the ICT Ministry, if we have a problem we pick it with them and not government, or are we looking for razzmatazz?? We should pressure Safaricom, KDN, Access and the rest to push their prices lower. Gakuru et al, are we assured of lower prices should he step down?
It's about taking responsibility, David. A minister in India resigned some time back after a rail accident, IIRC. He was govt, but was he driving the train? No? Same thing here. If the PS said prices would come down, then he should take responsibility. We know he doesn't run the outfits which should bring the prices down, but he has a say which can influence that. If not, I think he should still just resign for misleading the public:-) Someone must take responsibility. -- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
Maybe we wait for the definition of 'when' the prices were to come down then pass judgement. Josiah Mugambi +254 738 504418 http://blog.josiahmugambi.com * SK Classifeds... Visit stockskenya.co.ke for more info. * Get a .ke @ 2900/- a year VAT incl. @ pct.co.ke 2009/8/14 Odhiambo ワシントン <odhiambo@gmail.com>
2009/8/14 David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com>
It even sounds ludicrous ... Have prices come down? the answer is YES! is it to the satisfaction of people NO! Should Ndemo resign because the prices haven't come down to your satisfaction? let's be serious.
We buy capacity from ISPs and not from the ICT Ministry, if we have a problem we pick it with them and not government, or are we looking for razzmatazz?? We should pressure Safaricom, KDN, Access and the rest to push their prices lower. Gakuru et al, are we assured of lower prices should he step down?
It's about taking responsibility, David.
A minister in India resigned some time back after a rail accident, IIRC. He was govt, but was he driving the train? No? Same thing here. If the PS said prices would come down, then he should take responsibility. We know he doesn't run the outfits which should bring the prices down, but he has a say which can influence that. If not, I think he should still just resign for misleading the public:-)
Someone must take responsibility.
-- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
@david it seems you have other interest other than what we consumer are concerned about you need to remember why we have an ICT ministry in the first place and the reasons it is allocated tax payers money. the reason to why we crying fowl,is bcoz we know what we want,he committed himself to it even after skeptics questioned him,he has been having a party with the cameras showing the much he knows and is involved and flying out and about with our money plsss. WHERE IS THE PROMISE!!!! WE PAID FOR IT 2009/8/14 David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com>
It even sounds ludicrous ... Have prices come down? the answer is YES! is it to the satisfaction of people NO! Should Ndemo resign because the prices haven't come down to your satisfaction? let's be serious.
We buy capacity from ISPs and not from the ICT Ministry, if we have a problem we pick it with them and not government, or are we looking for razzmatazz?? We should pressure Safaricom, KDN, Access and the rest to push their prices lower. Gakuru et al, are we assured of lower prices should he step down?
Kiania
2009/8/14 Odhiambo ワシントン <odhiambo@gmail.com>:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Muniu Kariuki<dennis.muniu@gmail.com> wrote:
Gakuru, totaly agree with you.Kiania, what do you suggest should be done?
I think Gakuru is right. If PS Ndemo promised that prices would drop, he
was
doing that from a "know it" stand point. He knew how they would. The question is "when" should they be coming down? Did he also give an indication of when, or at what point? That way we can go back to him and ask why things are not happening. Gakuru is representing those consumers who are asking the same questions:-)
-- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Granted. Say he resigns what next? 2009/8/14 excuseme yespliz <xgetbusy@gmail.com>:
@david
it seems you have other interest other than what we consumer are concerned about
you need to remember why we have an ICT ministry in the first place and the reasons it is allocated tax payers money. the reason to why we crying fowl,is bcoz we know what we want,he committed himself to it even after skeptics questioned him,he has been having a party with the cameras showing the much he knows and is involved and flying out and about with our money plsss.
WHERE IS THE PROMISE!!!! WE PAID FOR IT
2009/8/14 David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com>
It even sounds ludicrous ... Have prices come down? the answer is YES! is it to the satisfaction of people NO! Should Ndemo resign because the prices haven't come down to your satisfaction? let's be serious.
We buy capacity from ISPs and not from the ICT Ministry, if we have a problem we pick it with them and not government, or are we looking for razzmatazz?? We should pressure Safaricom, KDN, Access and the rest to push their prices lower. Gakuru et al, are we assured of lower prices should he step down?
Kiania
2009/8/14 Odhiambo ワシントン <odhiambo@gmail.com>:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Muniu Kariuki<dennis.muniu@gmail.com> wrote:
Gakuru, totaly agree with you.Kiania, what do you suggest should be done?
I think Gakuru is right. If PS Ndemo promised that prices would drop, he was doing that from a "know it" stand point. He knew how they would. The question is "when" should they be coming down? Did he also give an indication of when, or at what point? That way we can go back to him and ask why things are not happening. Gakuru is representing those consumers who are asking the same questions:-)
-- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- [Asentric Consulting Ltd] If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth .... -Richest Man in Babylon
2009/8/14 David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com>
Granted. Say he resigns what next?
We get the next PS to ensure prices come down:-) Seriously though, when someone steps aside (in the name of taking responsibility), nothing should be expected to happen consequent upon that action/resignation. -- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
we get a better deal if not we seek other solutions elsewhere with sincere telecos who will not reap as off with lies that are hard to prove!!!!!!! teams ,seacom ,whatever are not the architects of super speeds solutions. companys are many geezzz 2009/8/14 David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com>
Granted. Say he resigns what next?
2009/8/14 excuseme yespliz <xgetbusy@gmail.com>:
@david
it seems you have other interest other than what we consumer are concerned about
you need to remember why we have an ICT ministry in the first place and the reasons it is allocated tax payers money. the reason to why we crying fowl,is bcoz we know what we want,he committed himself to it even after skeptics questioned him,he has been having a party with the cameras showing the much he knows and is involved and flying out and about with our money plsss.
WHERE IS THE PROMISE!!!! WE PAID FOR IT
2009/8/14 David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com>
It even sounds ludicrous ... Have prices come down? the answer is YES! is it to the satisfaction of people NO! Should Ndemo resign because the prices haven't come down to your satisfaction? let's be serious.
We buy capacity from ISPs and not from the ICT Ministry, if we have a problem we pick it with them and not government, or are we looking for razzmatazz?? We should pressure Safaricom, KDN, Access and the rest to push their prices lower. Gakuru et al, are we assured of lower prices should he step down?
Kiania
2009/8/14 Odhiambo ワシントン <odhiambo@gmail.com>:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com>
wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 3:40 PM, Muniu Kariuki<
dennis.muniu@gmail.com>
wrote:
Gakuru, totaly agree with you.Kiania, what do you suggest should be done?
I think Gakuru is right. If PS Ndemo promised that prices would drop, he was doing that from a "know it" stand point. He knew how they would. The question is "when" should they be coming down? Did he also give an indication of when, or at what point? That way we can go back to him and ask why things are not happening. Gakuru is representing those consumers who are asking the same questions:-)
-- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
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--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
I think what should happen is that for the same cost of your connection, the bandwidth to be increased proportionally cause lowering costs is not common-place. -- Regards, Job Njogu Muriuki, Phone: (Orange) +254772333075 (Zain) +254736333075, (Orange fixed plus) +254202360107 Address: 42665 00100 Nrb
This is one of the first time a PS has been in the limelight - he has really done alot to make sure Kenya was connected. The other ministries have been a series of disappointments and empty promises.. I believe the Min Of Info has outdone itself. And also, the PS is involved in other projects and duties, he cannot be made to resign on account of one project [which is mostly run by private investors]... that will be a bit much to demand. The promise - if I remember correctly was to bring prices from USD. 7500/8000 per mb to USD. 200 per MB. The arrival of anything usually creates a lee-way to change - but not an immediate change. My suggestion is - we should give it more time.... I remember when our parents were buying the Siemens A35/A45 back in the 2001-2002 period for Ksh. 9999 - the phone was on offer and Kenyans thought it was really cheap.. Considering that the rich had mobile phones [before GSM for Ksh. 250,000 subscribed over a period of time] Now, a few years down the line - as the inventors/manufacturers of the Siemens A45 have recouped research money and the opex of phone factories has already been laid... manufacturing phones has become easier [and cheaper, considering].. I think the phone goes for Ksh. 1000 now [in Luthuli] We expect the same - down the years as ISPs take up positions and develop packages - which will result in the zain-safcom-orange-econet price wars we are seeing now... The prices will come down for internet as they try to hook up the customer base, because now they can afford it....
Ndungu, You are proposing we take a "sympathetic" approach and "recognision of the great things" CIVIL SERVANTS - paid generously with public taxes? It has never been a favour anyone of then to deliver to us but an obligation and a responsibility that must be fulfilled. It is our right to demand that they deliver. One could also list several other failures, but let us focus here on the repeatedly promised cheap internet compare and contrast it with the cold hard reality that prices won't drop. We shall not accept morphed excuses that perpetuate Wanjiku's exploitation by guys who all load the billions of telecoms loot onto aircraft boots every year and ship it to their homes, sweet hope. hapana!! He engineered the TEAM ownership composition. Public-private partnership-fine! Did he not plan and provide for the current telecoms cartels (going by their utterances) He reduced government shareholding on TEAMS to 20%.TEAMS allowed some, said later unable to pay-up, to become shareholders. Was PUBLIC INTEREST never part of the plans. Please spare us the "market-forces" argument-our telecoms sector has been a failed market. Beware also that although capitalism and democracy often sound similar, they are quite different. Democracies that let loose excessive corporate greed on their people years on end, and are opposed to alternative view cease and lose their "democratic" status. On your argument that
And also, the PS is involved in other projects and duties, he cannot be made to resign on account of one project [which is mostly run by private investors]... that will be a bit much to demand.
Will Kenya cease to be when the last of (current) cabinet members, MPs, you and me die? (no pun intended) The country is above all over us and all we are demanding is that employees paid by us to ensure it, do their job for which the public temporarily hired them for -- that's all of them!! Who's in charge here or what's at play? Mobitelea memories do not occupy a very precious part of our heritage. Note that I left Ndemo an escape route "if internet prices do not drop as he promised" on this thread. If the prices remain in the skies, them he steps down. If they lower as he promised aendelee.... Alex On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 6:12 PM, ndungu stephen<ndungustephen@gmail.com> wrote:
This is one of the first time a PS has been in the limelight - he has really done alot to make sure Kenya was connected.
The other ministries have been a series of disappointments and empty promises.. I believe the Min Of Info has outdone itself.
And also, the PS is involved in other projects and duties, he cannot be made to resign on account of one project [which is mostly run by private investors]... that will be a bit much to demand.
The promise - if I remember correctly was to bring prices from USD. 7500/8000 per mb to USD. 200 per MB.
The arrival of anything usually creates a lee-way to change - but not an immediate change.
My suggestion is - we should give it more time.... I remember when our parents were buying the Siemens A35/A45 back in the 2001-2002 period for Ksh. 9999 - the phone was on offer and Kenyans thought it was really cheap..
Considering that the rich had mobile phones [before GSM for Ksh. 250,000 subscribed over a period of time]
Now, a few years down the line - as the inventors/manufacturers of the Siemens A45 have recouped research money and the opex of phone factories has already been laid... manufacturing phones has become easier [and cheaper, considering]..
I think the phone goes for Ksh. 1000 now [in Luthuli]
We expect the same - down the years as ISPs take up positions and develop packages - which will result in the zain-safcom-orange-econet price wars we are seeing now...
The prices will come down for internet as they try to hook up the customer base, because now they can afford it....
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Alex Like I have said it everywhere and my friend is even updating his twitter with it all the time and started the facebook campaign, let Ndemo not take us for fools MO On 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
@David,
I am typing this very far from where I work - because my internet connection, once again, automagically 'developed technical problems' immediately after i posted that message.
Frankly, I am not sorry even for a single letter on that email.Eenough is enough!
Alex
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs, using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
< http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ar...
"..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
<
http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bc...
---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator?
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce:
http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce
Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Alex am sure we can all lobby for better prices without forcing people to resign. I dont want to see skunkers singing "Ma Skunkers msilale,lale lale (* 2) ,bado mapambano". like everybody does in this country...in the end instead of building everything is destoryed. On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:13 PM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex
Like I have said it everywhere and my friend is even updating his twitter with it all the time and started the facebook campaign, let Ndemo not take us for fools
MO
On 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
@David,
I am typing this very far from where I work - because my internet connection, once again, automagically 'developed technical problems' immediately after i posted that message.
Frankly, I am not sorry even for a single letter on that email.Eenough is enough!
Alex
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs, using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
< http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ar...
"..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
<
http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bc...
---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator?
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce:
http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce
Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
McDonald where are you from? You are contented with the status quo because you are not patriotic to this country. Dont argue because you have special interest which doesnt care if Kenya moves forward or not On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 2:22 PM, Joseph McDonald <mcdonaldoj@gmail.com>wrote:
Alex am sure we can all lobby for better prices without forcing people to resign.
I dont want to see skunkers singing
"Ma Skunkers msilale,lale lale (* 2) ,bado mapambano".
like everybody does in this country...in the end instead of building everything is destoryed.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:13 PM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com>wrote:
Alex
Like I have said it everywhere and my friend is even updating his twitter with it all the time and started the facebook campaign, let Ndemo not take us for fools
MO
On 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
@David,
I am typing this very far from where I work - because my internet connection, once again, automagically 'developed technical problems' immediately after i posted that message.
Frankly, I am not sorry even for a single letter on that email.Eenough is enough!
Alex
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs, using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex< alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
< http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ar...
"..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
<
http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bc...
---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator?
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce:
http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce
Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Dont get me wrong I also want the internet prices to go down.And I support any lobbying which will result to fair prices to the consumers. What I had an issue with is the way.....we want to go about it. And the way you have asked me where am from, just shows the levels which some skunkers can go to drive their points. We can all have healthy debates without bordering on abuse.THATS ALLL AM SAYING. On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 11:20 AM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
McDonald where are you from? You are contented with the status quo because you are not patriotic to this country. Dont argue because you have special interest which doesnt care if Kenya moves forward or not
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 2:22 PM, Joseph McDonald <mcdonaldoj@gmail.com>wrote:
Alex am sure we can all lobby for better prices without forcing people to resign.
I dont want to see skunkers singing
"Ma Skunkers msilale,lale lale (* 2) ,bado mapambano".
like everybody does in this country...in the end instead of building everything is destoryed.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:13 PM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com>wrote:
Alex
Like I have said it everywhere and my friend is even updating his twitter with it all the time and started the facebook campaign, let Ndemo not take us for fools
MO
On 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
@David,
I am typing this very far from where I work - because my internet connection, once again, automagically 'developed technical problems' immediately after i posted that message.
Frankly, I am not sorry even for a single letter on that email.Eenough is enough!
Alex
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs, using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex< alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
< http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ar...
"..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections
to
international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
< http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bc...
---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c)
continue
living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator?
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Joseph Do you know why otehrs are catholic, Others Legio maria and otehrs Free pentecost? Because your way of asking for alms or right is not my way so as long as your way dont interfere with my rights, we will have to form an lobby equivalent to NCCK That way will be good but dont force me to be in your denomination and pray the way you do. MO On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 6:17 PM, Joseph McDonald <mcdonaldoj@gmail.com>wrote:
Dont get me wrong I also want the internet prices to go down.And I support any lobbying which will result to fair prices to the consumers.
What I had an issue with is the way.....we want to go about it.
And the way you have asked me where am from, just shows the levels which some skunkers can go to drive their points.
We can all have healthy debates without bordering on abuse.THATS ALLL AM SAYING.
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 11:20 AM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com>wrote:
McDonald where are you from? You are contented with the status quo because you are not patriotic to this country. Dont argue because you have special interest which doesnt care if Kenya moves forward or not
On Sat, Aug 15, 2009 at 2:22 PM, Joseph McDonald <mcdonaldoj@gmail.com>wrote:
Alex am sure we can all lobby for better prices without forcing people to resign.
I dont want to see skunkers singing
"Ma Skunkers msilale,lale lale (* 2) ,bado mapambano".
like everybody does in this country...in the end instead of building everything is destoryed.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:13 PM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com>wrote:
Alex
Like I have said it everywhere and my friend is even updating his twitter with it all the time and started the facebook campaign, let Ndemo not take us for fools
MO
On 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
@David,
I am typing this very far from where I work - because my internet connection, once again, automagically 'developed technical problems' immediately after i posted that message.
Frankly, I am not sorry even for a single letter on that email.Eenough is enough!
Alex
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:45 AM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
I think this is going overboard, how could we judge Ndemo on one parameter based on a parameter that is this subjective? Bottom-line what the overall performance of the PS have to do with private ISPs, using a private company's submarine fiber? While are at it why don't we demand that Michael Joseph (MD of a Publicly listed company) be forced tor resign on the same basis?
Please let's tone down our activism for more worthwhile causes.
Kiania.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex< alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote: > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> > Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM > Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices > do not drop as he promised!! > To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net> > > > What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was... > > ---Business Daily--- > > "we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically > as initially indicated or within a short time-frame" > > < http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ar...
> > "..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on > its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to > international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.." > > < http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bc...
> > ---summary--- > in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a > just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously > expecting "market-forces" to push prices down - > > The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government > officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) > demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue > living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have > "affordable" internet in Kenya. > > Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised > Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to > believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet > prices do not go down as he promised. > > And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the > government and the regulator? > > Alex > _______________________________________________ > Skunkworks mailing list > Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke > http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks > Other services @ http://my.co.ke > Other lists > ------------- > Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce > Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science > kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general >
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On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 7:54 PM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
Joseph Do you know why otehrs are catholic, Others Legio maria and otehrs Free pentecost? Because your way of asking for alms or right is not my way so as long as your way dont interfere with my rights, we will have to form an lobby equivalent to NCCK
That way will be good but dont force me to be in your denomination and pray the way you do.
MO
@MO, When are you going into politics? I'll vote for you:-) Seriously, sometimes I just can't help admire your level of adamance! -- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254733744121/+254722743223 _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "If you have nothing good to say about someone, just shut up!." -- Lucky Dube
alex wake up and smell the coffee this kenya + The LPG gas was zerorated did u see price drops ? nothing + The ladies sanitary pads were zero rated, did u see the prices going down nothing? + the govt promised with a long ugly formula to fix price controls for fuel from Jan2009, did happen ... nothing.? + and so on motobikes, radios, ict gears,pampers.... prices can go one direction Northbound, whether ndemo stays or not On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>wrote:
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Alex Gakuru <gakuru@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:11 AM Subject: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: ke-users <ke-internetusers@bdix.net>
What a long optics fibre lie the whole thing was...
---Business Daily---
"we do not anticipate that [Internet] prices will drop as drastically as initially indicated or within a short time-frame"
< http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/639386/-/u8ar...
"..it was planning to implement an immediate 24 per cent discount on its internet charges and promised higher discounts once connections to international fibre optic links went live by the end of next month.."
< http://www.businessdailyafrica.com/Company%20Industry/-/539550/638808/-/u8bc...
---summary--- in short, consumers are going to continue being ripped-off while a just too comfortable "hands-off" government sits back pretentiously expecting "market-forces" to push prices down -
The way I see it? we have several options a) to demand government officers( Ndemo & Co.) who promised cheap internet to resign, b) demand regulator to wake up and proactively set the prices c) continue living in a denial and that,hopefully, one day we will have "affordable" internet in Kenya.
Where is Bitange Ndemo and and why did he lie to us and raised Kenyans' hopes for cheap internet? we shall have serious problems to believe anything he promises henceforth. He should resign if internet prices do not go down as he promised.
And who runs this country anyway? telecommunication companies or the government and the regulator?
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:18 PM, Paul Msava<pmsava@gmail.com> wrote:
alex wake up and smell the coffee this kenya + The LPG gas was zerorated did u see price drops ? nothing + The ladies sanitary pads were zero rated, did u see the prices going down nothing? + the govt promised with a long ugly formula to fix price controls for fuel from Jan2009, did happen ... nothing.? + and so on motobikes, radios, ict gears,pampers....
prices can go one direction Northbound, whether ndemo stays or not
What is your solution to the problem?
Alex, Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if you did we'd have heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction to a bad internet day, we all have one. Hope you dont have the gumption to suggest Ndemo's resignation is either. Kiania. On 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:18 PM, Paul Msava<pmsava@gmail.com> wrote:
alex wake up and smell the coffee this kenya + The LPG gas was zerorated did u see price drops ? nothing + The ladies sanitary pads were zero rated, did u see the prices going down nothing? + the govt promised with a long ugly formula to fix price controls for fuel from Jan2009, did happen ... nothing.? + and so on motobikes, radios, ict gears,pampers....
prices can go one direction Northbound, whether ndemo stays or not
What is your solution to the problem? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-- [Asentric Consulting Ltd] If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth .... -Richest Man in Babylon
Alex, Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if you did we'd have heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction to a bad internet day, we all have one. Hope you dont have the gumption to suggest Ndemo's resignation is either. Kiania. On 8/14/09, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd <kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Alex,
Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if you did we'd have heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction to a bad internet day, we all have one.
Hope you dont have the gumption to suggest Ndemo's resignation is either.
Kiania.
On 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:18 PM, Paul Msava<pmsava@gmail.com> wrote:
alex wake up and smell the coffee this kenya + The LPG gas was zerorated did u see price drops ? nothing + The ladies sanitary pads were zero rated, did u see the prices going down nothing? + the govt promised with a long ugly formula to fix price controls for fuel from Jan2009, did happen ... nothing.? + and so on motobikes, radios, ict gears,pampers....
prices can go one direction Northbound, whether ndemo stays or not
What is your solution to the problem? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon
-- [Asentric Consulting Ltd] If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth .... -Richest Man in Babylon
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:38 PM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if you did we'd have heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction to a bad internet day, we all have one.
Simple, the entity under Ndemo's docket that grants these cowboy operators licenses puts it's foot down and warn that I may revoke licenses for operators that charge waaaay up in the sky not just above cost but ABOVE acceptable international pricing benchmarks. They've all the data they need. Imagine, for example, Safaricom on the verge of losing their license, price drops, drops, drops, drops, drops, and drops..... across board. Would this be acceptable to you?
btw, David I warned about the cartels in 2007 see Fibre Eco-politics on 'Low internet diffusion in Africa - Alex Gakuru, ICT Consumers Association (PPT)' in reference to Africa’s hope pegged on Kenya’s TEAMS Fiber [model's proper] handling http://freedomofexpression.org.uk/resources/africa+workshop+report+resources I suggest you also download Lisa Horner's 'Layer model presentation' regards, On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:44 PM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:38 PM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if you did we'd have heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction to a bad internet day, we all have one.
Simple, the entity under Ndemo's docket that grants these cowboy operators licenses puts it's foot down and warn that I may revoke licenses for operators that charge waaaay up in the sky not just above cost but ABOVE acceptable international pricing benchmarks. They've all the data they need. Imagine, for example, Safaricom on the verge of losing their license, price drops, drops, drops, drops, drops, and drops..... across board.
Would this be acceptable to you?
Hi all,
From the look of things, Ndemo seems to be quite an honorable man to point of him accepting to address a tech team.I respect his strides as compared with the rest in his flock! (I am not entirely saying he is right in any way for such a gesture)
My issue is,why were all these questions not drawn to him when he was around physically??? @Gakuru I thought you assisted in the moderation then and you had the best opportunity to pose the same sentiments you expressed here.Not unless all played the 'sycophant' game. Then where does this talk regarding this post end up to...a mail archive?Should not be the case...what are the planned directives??? Chris_w. dabnix@gmail.com On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 8:01 PM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>wrote:
btw, David I warned about the cartels in 2007 see Fibre Eco-politics on 'Low internet diffusion in Africa - Alex Gakuru, ICT Consumers Association (PPT)' in reference to Africa’s hope pegged on Kenya’s TEAMS Fiber [model's proper] handling
http://freedomofexpression.org.uk/resources/africa+workshop+report+resources
I suggest you also download Lisa Horner's 'Layer model presentation'
regards,
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:44 PM, Gakuru Alex<alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:38 PM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if you did we'd have heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction to a bad internet day, we all have one.
Simple, the entity under Ndemo's docket that grants these cowboy operators licenses puts it's foot down and warn that I may revoke licenses for operators that charge waaaay up in the sky not just above cost but ABOVE acceptable international pricing benchmarks. They've all the data they need. Imagine, for example, Safaricom on the verge of losing their license, price drops, drops, drops, drops, drops, and drops..... across board.
Would this be acceptable to you?
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 9:05 PM, Chris W.<dabnix@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi all,
From the look of things, Ndemo seems to be quite an honorable man to point of him accepting to address a tech team.I respect his strides as compared with the rest in his flock! (I am not entirely saying he is right in any way for such a gesture)
My issue is,why were all these questions not drawn to him when he was around physically???
Check the archives- I'd requested those that had prior raised "important governance questions" onlist to use that forum to pose their questions to him ( and not ask me). You recall he also clarified "he does not speak through Gakuru"? Never claimed it, ever.
@Gakuru I thought you assisted in the moderation then and you had the best opportunity to pose the same sentiments you expressed here.
When one's the moderator, the "privilege" of shooting-straight is forfeited:( The other consideration is to avoid moderator 'dominating' the forum- i find those that do where I attend quite annoying since their session role is to moderate the conversations not hijack them. Were you present?
Not unless all played the 'sycophant' game.
...pass...
Then where does this talk regarding this post end up to...a mail archive?Should not be the case...
for starters, knowledge exchange is good:)
what are the planned directives???
by/from whom?
If I may add to the discussion. My view : I think the article in BD is what has set things in motion so Alex may not have been able to bring up the issues earlier with Hon Ndemo. Teams seems like a twisted affair, I just found out today that each investor in teams goes their own way to get bandwidth from various cable providers who terminate in Fujairah. So where does GOK get its bandwidth from, Etisalat? There are more than 3 cable companies Seame We 3/4, Reliance and Etisalat. Seame We 3 goes upto UK while Seame We 4 goes to France. Reliance is Mumbai and France. This is the strange part of Teams : - Why pull a cable all the way from Mombasa to Fujiarah, which is really a half circuit? - Since the half circuit is kenyan, who maintains the cable and who bears the costs of breakages and repair? If 20% of Tax payer money went to fund it, build it and maintain it for eg 20 years yet the distribution of the 20% share capacity into public networks will not happen unless Govt IT section becomes an ISP. So now there are 4-5 different IRUs on the same cable. Each IRU share holder on kenyan route has paid money in advance and will not drop rates any time soon until they get some returns. So who excatly was Teams benefitting? Service Providers who wanted a competitive route to Seacom and partly funded by Tax payers? This is all confusing.... Solution : We wait to learn more about it and see how Teams is going to benefit kenyans. My amatuer views.....
TEAMS is a public-private partnership. Has it gone live? No. Currently, there is no competition on the fiber table. Its all monopoly. SEACOM is a private entity. Service providers buy bandwidth at a tenth of what they used to buy it. EASSY to land next year in June. A private entity. Goverment creates a thriving environment for healthy competition in the industry. An environment that ensures that businesses can survive, and that the users can enjoy quality, reliable services at affordable costs. Have prices come down? YES. On the corporate front, so far, we have KDN and AK who have lowered prices or provided double/quadruple bandwidth for the same prices. NO. Home users have seen no change in prices. Is it coming? We dont know. Rumours of safaricom introducing some interesting pricing. Will Zuku/AFOL/AK/Swift/Safcom/Orange/Yu/Zain reduce their prices? We dont know, yet. What is the time to judge whether it will happen? For me, once we have competition, i.e. TEAMs live. In another month or two hopefully. Maybe CCK should step in, the way they did with interconnection rates amongst mobile providers. To resign or not, its upto Dr. Ndemo. Tito.
Actually I've just worked it out on paper and figured it out so bear with me that I may not have all the boardroom facts. I think Alex's remarks about price reductions are correct and that also Hon Ndemo may also have been mis-guided by the share holders of Teams regarding pricing. From the view that kenya needed its own cable and that the Govt only needed 20% of the capacity for its own needs, the rest would be invested for by SPs and share holders. I think this is why Hon Ndemo would have said that pricing would be coming down. The half circuit between Mombasa and Fujairah is owned and not leased on a per circuit basis. Therefore, eg cost of an STM1 on the half circuit would be negligible over time. The only charges incurred would be the rest of the half circuit in termination to other cable companies. I'll go into the figures soon but I think what has changed is the initial investments done by the share holders and how soon they can recover the costs on the half circuit cable. Did they take loans to repay over 20 years or not? They maybe buying an IRU at 5-10USD at fujairah and trying to cost the recovery of initial investments, thus landed at Mombasa would be 25USD . Seacom IRU drop drastically after 3 years, so will the half circuit cost drop in 1 or 2 years? Something changed in the grand Teams plan. Share holding changes or more expensive IRUs at Fujairah or local borrowing ?
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 11:48 PM, aki<aki275@googlemail.com> wrote:
Ndemo may also have been mis-guided by the share holders of Teams regarding pricing.
I once read something interesting (when on travel in Uganda):- "A boss is never late, he only gets delayed Never asks for pay rise but salary adjustment Never gets drunk he only only tipsy, Never wrong or lies only get misled." The BOSS here is PUBLIC INTEREST:)
Alex, Your have rightly qaulified your solution - as simple. Indeed it is. Infact too simplistic to fly. The idea that the Regulator can reign in Operators who charge "high" internet rates cannot and will not work. Think about the in-famous SAT3 fiber link on the west coast of africa. Ask yourself why the Regulators in Nigeria, Ghana, Cameroon, Angola, S-Africa etc have never stepped in and revoked licensces of operators over the last 15yrs of high internet costs offered on the fiber... The answers are very complex...I will actually be discussing these limitations and available interventions in some upcoming ICT conference at Strath University in Sept 09 and I dont want to pre-empt ;-).... walu. --- On Fri, 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Fwd: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: "Skunkworks forum" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Date: Friday, August 14, 2009, 8:44 PM On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:38 PM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if
you did we'd have
heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction to a bad internet day, we all have one.
Simple, the entity under Ndemo's docket that grants these cowboy operators licenses puts it's foot down and warn that I may revoke licenses for operators that charge waaaay up in the sky not just above cost but ABOVE acceptable international pricing benchmarks. They've all the data they need. Imagine, for example, Safaricom on the verge of losing their license, price drops, drops, drops, drops, drops, and drops..... across board.
Would this be acceptable to you? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Walubengo Yours are just too simplistic than the Alex's you are saying that are simplistic. The fact that kenya could not regulate Oil prices doesnt mean that Tanzania couldnt. The fact that SAT 3 operators couldnt be regulated cannont mean that the operators here cannot be regulated. Stop all these fake comparisons. Prices must come down and we will face them at every conference and every Barcamp and will tell these unpatriotic who have pocketed our PS off. Your arguments just dont wash. MO On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Alex,
Your have rightly qaulified your solution - as simple. Indeed it is. Infact too simplistic to fly. The idea that the Regulator can reign in Operators who charge "high" internet rates cannot and will not work. Think about the in-famous SAT3 fiber link on the west coast of africa. Ask yourself why the Regulators in Nigeria, Ghana, Cameroon, Angola, S-Africa etc have never stepped in and revoked licensces of operators over the last 15yrs of high internet costs offered on the fiber...
The answers are very complex...I will actually be discussing these limitations and available interventions in some upcoming ICT conference at Strath University in Sept 09 and I dont want to pre-empt ;-)....
walu.
--- On Fri, 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Fwd: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: "Skunkworks forum" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Date: Friday, August 14, 2009, 8:44 PM On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:38 PM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if
you did we'd have
heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction to a bad internet day, we all have one.
Simple, the entity under Ndemo's docket that grants these cowboy operators licenses puts it's foot down and warn that I may revoke licenses for operators that charge waaaay up in the sky not just above cost but ABOVE acceptable international pricing benchmarks. They've all the data they need. Imagine, for example, Safaricom on the verge of losing their license, price drops, drops, drops, drops, drops, and drops..... across board.
Would this be acceptable to you? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Again Safaricom CEO who is also heads the board of TEAMS says that TEAMS benefits could not be realised because onward connection with Europe has not been fully discussed. How can you initiate a flight from Kenya to Nigeria without getting the landing rights in Nigeria and flight clearance for CAR, DRC, Sudan and all the countries you are going to overfly? Cheap Cheap Cheap and we wont be duped. I have seen people in this list who support the crooked CEOs just because they need favors for contracts and interviews for their educations research papers. Hypocrites they are. Lets be realistic MO On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 9:10 AM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
Walubengo Yours are just too simplistic than the Alex's you are saying that are simplistic. The fact that kenya could not regulate Oil prices doesnt mean that Tanzania couldnt. The fact that SAT 3 operators couldnt be regulated cannont mean that the operators here cannot be regulated.
Stop all these fake comparisons. Prices must come down and we will face them at every conference and every Barcamp and will tell these unpatriotic who have pocketed our PS off. Your arguments just dont wash.
MO
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Alex,
Your have rightly qaulified your solution - as simple. Indeed it is. Infact too simplistic to fly. The idea that the Regulator can reign in Operators who charge "high" internet rates cannot and will not work. Think about the in-famous SAT3 fiber link on the west coast of africa. Ask yourself why the Regulators in Nigeria, Ghana, Cameroon, Angola, S-Africa etc have never stepped in and revoked licensces of operators over the last 15yrs of high internet costs offered on the fiber...
The answers are very complex...I will actually be discussing these limitations and available interventions in some upcoming ICT conference at Strath University in Sept 09 and I dont want to pre-empt ;-)....
walu.
--- On Fri, 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Fwd: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!! To: "Skunkworks forum" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Date: Friday, August 14, 2009, 8:44 PM On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:38 PM, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if
you did we'd have
heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction to a bad internet day, we all have one.
Simple, the entity under Ndemo's docket that grants these cowboy operators licenses puts it's foot down and warn that I may revoke licenses for operators that charge waaaay up in the sky not just above cost but ABOVE acceptable international pricing benchmarks. They've all the data they need. Imagine, for example, Safaricom on the verge of losing their license, price drops, drops, drops, drops, drops, and drops..... across board.
Would this be acceptable to you? _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
MO, Alex, Ease up abit. Dont imagine I dont want affordable internet prices. Infact if you had time and googled my online contributions over the last 5years, you will realize I have been raising the red-flag about fiber vis a viz pricing. The other day I reloaded my Safcom modem with 1,000/= (300MB service). It all disappeared within 5days! Previously before SEACOM it would take longer (3weeks) to disappear because of the slower speeds. Better speeds encourage faster and broader browsing but it hurts (financially) and its not funny. I think our differences lie in the approach to having reduced prices. I chose the academic route because thats my background. Feel free to pursue your routes to reduced prices - but plse be cautious because the solution is NOT domiciled in ONE stakeholder. Its not with the Regulator, nor the techies, nor the activists, nor the Consumers, nor the Govt, nor the Media, etc. Instead I believe it is with ALL of the above. And it will be unfortunate to alienate any of them while pursuing reduced prices. walu. nb1: and thats why I had copied to what Alex calls my "home-tuff" (just ropping in other stakeholders). nb2: I also note and do appreciated your legal counterarguments but decline to respond as at now since I will cover that and other issues during the upcoming ICT conference at SU (I think will be free to sambaza the paper thereafter for those interested). --- On Mon, 8/17/09, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
From: mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] the long fibre lie...Regulatory Action limited. To: "Skunkworks forum" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Date: Monday, August 17, 2009, 10:13 AM Again Safaricom CEO who is also heads the board of TEAMS says that TEAMS benefits could not be realised because onward connection with Europe has not been fully discussed. How can you initiate a flight from Kenya to Nigeria without getting the landing rights in Nigeria and flight clearance for CAR, DRC, Sudan and all the countries you are going to overfly?
Cheap Cheap Cheap and we wont be duped. I have seen people in this list who support the crooked CEOs just because they need favors for contracts and interviews for their educations research papers. Hypocrites they are.
Lets be realistic MO
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 9:10 AM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
Walubengo Yours are just too simplistic than the Alex's you are saying that are simplistic. The fact that kenya could not regulate Oil prices doesnt mean that Tanzania couldnt. The fact that SAT 3 operators couldnt be regulated cannont mean that the operators here cannot be regulated.
Stop all these fake comparisons. Prices must come down and we will face them at every conference and every Barcamp and will tell these unpatriotic who have pocketed our PS off. Your arguments just dont wash.
MO
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Alex,
Your have rightly qaulified your solution - as simple. Indeed it is. Infact too simplistic to fly. The idea that the Regulator can reign in Operators who charge "high" internet rates cannot and will not work. Think about the in-famous SAT3 fiber link on the west coast of africa. Ask yourself why the Regulators in Nigeria, Ghana, Cameroon, Angola, S-Africa etc have never stepped in and revoked licensces of operators over the last 15yrs of high internet costs offered on the fiber...
The answers are very complex...I will actually be discussing these limitations and available interventions in some upcoming ICT conference at Strath University in Sept 09 and I dont want to pre-empt ;-)....
walu.
--- On Fri, 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Fwd: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!!
To: "Skunkworks forum" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke>
Date: Friday, August 14, 2009, 8:44 PM
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:38 PM,
David Kiania | Asentric Consulting
Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com>
wrote:
Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if
you did we'd have
heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction
to a bad internet
day, we all have one.
Simple, the entity under Ndemo's docket that grants these
cowboy
operators licenses puts it's foot down and warn that I may
revoke
licenses for operators that charge waaaay up in the sky not
just above
cost but ABOVE acceptable international pricing benchmarks.
They've
all the data they need. Imagine, for example, Safaricom on
the verge
of losing their license, price drops, drops, drops, drops,
drops, and
drops..... across board.
Would this be acceptable to you?
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list
Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke
Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Other lists
-------------
Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce
Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science
kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list
Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke
http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks
Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Other lists
-------------
Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce
Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science
kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
Walu I agree but dont expect Techies and Activists to behave teh same way and push for the price cut trhough the same means. There are people who will resort to stone throwing, otehrs to booing speakers, otehrs denying them contracts and otehrs simply hacking their systems So your way is not the only way MO On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 1:10 PM, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
MO, Alex,
Ease up abit. Dont imagine I dont want affordable internet prices. Infact if you had time and googled my online contributions over the last 5years, you will realize I have been raising the red-flag about fiber vis a viz pricing. The other day I reloaded my Safcom modem with 1,000/= (300MB service). It all disappeared within 5days! Previously before SEACOM it would take longer (3weeks) to disappear because of the slower speeds. Better speeds encourage faster and broader browsing but it hurts (financially) and its not funny.
I think our differences lie in the approach to having reduced prices. I chose the academic route because thats my background. Feel free to pursue your routes to reduced prices - but plse be cautious because the solution is NOT domiciled in ONE stakeholder. Its not with the Regulator, nor the techies, nor the activists, nor the Consumers, nor the Govt, nor the Media, etc. Instead I believe it is with ALL of the above. And it will be unfortunate to alienate any of them while pursuing reduced prices.
walu. nb1: and thats why I had copied to what Alex calls my "home-tuff" (just ropping in other stakeholders). nb2: I also note and do appreciated your legal counterarguments but decline to respond as at now since I will cover that and other issues during the upcoming ICT conference at SU (I think will be free to sambaza the paper thereafter for those interested).
--- On Mon, 8/17/09, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
From: mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] the long fibre lie...Regulatory Action limited. To: "Skunkworks forum" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Date: Monday, August 17, 2009, 10:13 AM Again Safaricom CEO who is also heads the board of TEAMS says that TEAMS benefits could not be realised because onward connection with Europe has not been fully discussed. How can you initiate a flight from Kenya to Nigeria without getting the landing rights in Nigeria and flight clearance for CAR, DRC, Sudan and all the countries you are going to overfly?
Cheap Cheap Cheap and we wont be duped. I have seen people in this list who support the crooked CEOs just because they need favors for contracts and interviews for their educations research papers. Hypocrites they are.
Lets be realistic MO
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 9:10 AM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
Walubengo Yours are just too simplistic than the Alex's you are saying that are simplistic. The fact that kenya could not regulate Oil prices doesnt mean that Tanzania couldnt. The fact that SAT 3 operators couldnt be regulated cannont mean that the operators here cannot be regulated.
Stop all these fake comparisons. Prices must come down and we will face them at every conference and every Barcamp and will tell these unpatriotic who have pocketed our PS off. Your arguments just dont wash.
MO
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Alex,
Your have rightly qaulified your solution - as simple. Indeed it is. Infact too simplistic to fly. The idea that the Regulator can reign in Operators who charge "high" internet rates cannot and will not work. Think about the in-famous SAT3 fiber link on the west coast of africa. Ask yourself why the Regulators in Nigeria, Ghana, Cameroon, Angola, S-Africa etc have never stepped in and revoked licensces of operators over the last 15yrs of high internet costs offered on the fiber...
The answers are very complex...I will actually be discussing these limitations and available interventions in some upcoming ICT conference at Strath University in Sept 09 and I dont want to pre-empt ;-)....
walu.
--- On Fri, 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Fwd: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!!
To: "Skunkworks forum" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke>
Date: Friday, August 14, 2009, 8:44 PM
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:38 PM,
David Kiania | Asentric Consulting
Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com>
wrote:
Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if
you did we'd have
heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction
to a bad internet
day, we all have one.
Simple, the entity under Ndemo's docket that grants these
cowboy
operators licenses puts it's foot down and warn that I may
revoke
licenses for operators that charge waaaay up in the sky not
just above
cost but ABOVE acceptable international pricing benchmarks.
They've
all the data they need. Imagine, for example, Safaricom on
the verge
of losing their license, price drops, drops, drops, drops,
drops, and
drops..... across board.
Would this be acceptable to you?
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list
Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke
Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Other lists
-------------
Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce
Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science
kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list
Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke
http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks
Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Other lists
-------------
Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce
Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science
kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
-----Inline Attachment Follows-----
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
this thread is heated up because of our expectations that internet will be cheaper and affordable to our pockets. It dpoesn'tmake sense to have fast internet conection that you are charged based on the MB you down/upload rather than the speeds you are enjoying. This is what mamkes me shy from safcom modem. But i believe it the next few months and can go to a year or longer, prices of internet will be volatile rather than stable. providers will be forced to lower their prices as much as possible, but this may not trickle down to the common consumers at first but more faster to corporate world. Then who ever is clever he will target the home users who form the most majority and give affordable services. how will this happen ofcourse not by keeping quiet and wait for when , but by asking and demanding for affordable prices for internet...... On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 7:57 PM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
Walu I agree but dont expect Techies and Activists to behave teh same way and push for the price cut trhough the same means. There are people who will resort to stone throwing, otehrs to booing speakers, otehrs denying them contracts and otehrs simply hacking their systems
So your way is not the only way
MO
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 1:10 PM, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
MO, Alex,
Ease up abit. Dont imagine I dont want affordable internet prices. Infact if you had time and googled my online contributions over the last 5years, you will realize I have been raising the red-flag about fiber vis a viz pricing. The other day I reloaded my Safcom modem with 1,000/= (300MB service). It all disappeared within 5days! Previously before SEACOM it would take longer (3weeks) to disappear because of the slower speeds. Better speeds encourage faster and broader browsing but it hurts (financially) and its not funny.
I think our differences lie in the approach to having reduced prices. I chose the academic route because thats my background. Feel free to pursue your routes to reduced prices - but plse be cautious because the solution is NOT domiciled in ONE stakeholder. Its not with the Regulator, nor the techies, nor the activists, nor the Consumers, nor the Govt, nor the Media, etc. Instead I believe it is with ALL of the above. And it will be unfortunate to alienate any of them while pursuing reduced prices.
walu. nb1: and thats why I had copied to what Alex calls my "home-tuff" (just ropping in other stakeholders). nb2: I also note and do appreciated your legal counterarguments but decline to respond as at now since I will cover that and other issues during the upcoming ICT conference at SU (I think will be free to sambaza the paper thereafter for those interested).
--- On Mon, 8/17/09, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
From: mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] the long fibre lie...Regulatory Action limited. To: "Skunkworks forum" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Date: Monday, August 17, 2009, 10:13 AM Again Safaricom CEO who is also heads the board of TEAMS says that TEAMS benefits could not be realised because onward connection with Europe has not been fully discussed. How can you initiate a flight from Kenya to Nigeria without getting the landing rights in Nigeria and flight clearance for CAR, DRC, Sudan and all the countries you are going to overfly?
Cheap Cheap Cheap and we wont be duped. I have seen people in this list who support the crooked CEOs just because they need favors for contracts and interviews for their educations research papers. Hypocrites they are.
Lets be realistic MO
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 9:10 AM, mike oketch <mikeoketch@gmail.com> wrote:
Walubengo Yours are just too simplistic than the Alex's you are saying that are simplistic. The fact that kenya could not regulate Oil prices doesnt mean that Tanzania couldnt. The fact that SAT 3 operators couldnt be regulated cannont mean that the operators here cannot be regulated.
Stop all these fake comparisons. Prices must come down and we will face them at every conference and every Barcamp and will tell these unpatriotic who have pocketed our PS off. Your arguments just dont wash.
MO
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Walubengo J <jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Alex,
Your have rightly qaulified your solution - as simple. Indeed it is. Infact too simplistic to fly. The idea that the Regulator can reign in Operators who charge "high" internet rates cannot and will not work. Think about the in-famous SAT3 fiber link on the west coast of africa. Ask yourself why the Regulators in Nigeria, Ghana, Cameroon, Angola, S-Africa etc have never stepped in and revoked licensces of operators over the last 15yrs of high internet costs offered on the fiber...
The answers are very complex...I will actually be discussing these limitations and available interventions in some upcoming ICT conference at Strath University in Sept 09 and I dont want to pre-empt ;-)....
walu.
--- On Fri, 8/14/09, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Fwd: the long fibre lie... Ndemo should resign if internet prices do not drop as he promised!!
To: "Skunkworks forum" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke>
Date: Friday, August 14, 2009, 8:44 PM
On Fri, Aug 14, 2009 at 7:38 PM,
David Kiania | Asentric Consulting
Ltd<kianiadee@gmail.com>
wrote:
Set the precedence what's your solution? Am sure if
you did we'd have
heard it by now. This thread is a knee jerk reaction
to a bad internet
day, we all have one.
Simple, the entity under Ndemo's docket that grants these
cowboy
operators licenses puts it's foot down and warn that I may
revoke
licenses for operators that charge waaaay up in the sky not
just above
cost but ABOVE acceptable international pricing benchmarks.
They've
all the data they need. Imagine, for example, Safaricom on
the verge
of losing their license, price drops, drops, drops, drops,
drops, and
drops..... across board.
Would this be acceptable to you?
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list
Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke
Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Other lists
-------------
Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce
Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science
kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list
Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke
http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks
Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Other lists
-------------
Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce
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kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
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On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Walubengo J<jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Alex,
Your have rightly qaulified your solution - as simple. Indeed it is. Infact too simplistic to fly.
Your argument borders on suggesting that the police should not arrest the next criminal they come across, because there are too may others out there anyway why bother arresting this one?
The idea that the Regulator can reign in Operators who charge "high" internet rates cannot and will not work.
It is not "an idea" bw. 'academician' but the letter of the law. "Under sections 23 and 47 of the Kenya Communications Act of 1998, the Commission is required to ensure that communications services are provided throughout Kenya and that the interests of all users of these services are protected with respect to prices charged for and the quality and variety of those services among other responsibilities." <http://www.cck.go.ke/consumer_center> Read also The Competition Bill, 2009 and The Consumer Protection Bill, 2007 My old friend John, it is now becoming increasingly harder to engage with your defensive lines of arguments. I also note you have copied this message to your "home tuff":-) Regards, Alex
The fire rages on, well Alex in my limited knowledge the law recognises companies as "Corporate Citizens" in the same way it recognises Mwananchi, we have to find a middle ground, maybe its time to take this "War" to Bunge, what do you think ? seems like it is a rights issue...haki yetu On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 9:59 AM, Gakuru Alex <alexgakuru.lists@gmail.com>wrote:
On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 8:40 AM, Walubengo J<jwalu@yahoo.com> wrote:
Alex,
Your have rightly qaulified your solution - as simple. Indeed it is. Infact too simplistic to fly.
Your argument borders on suggesting that the police should not arrest the next criminal they come across, because there are too may others out there anyway why bother arresting this one?
The idea that the Regulator can reign in Operators who charge "high" internet rates cannot and will not work.
It is not "an idea" bw. 'academician' but the letter of the law.
"Under sections 23 and 47 of the Kenya Communications Act of 1998, the Commission is required to ensure that communications services are provided throughout Kenya and that the interests of all users of these services are protected with respect to prices charged for and the quality and variety of those services among other responsibilities."
<http://www.cck.go.ke/consumer_center>
Read also The Competition Bill, 2009 and The Consumer Protection Bill, 2007
My old friend John, it is now becoming increasingly harder to engage with your defensive lines of arguments. I also note you have copied this message to your "home tuff":-)
Regards,
Alex _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks Other services @ http://my.co.ke Other lists ------------- Announce: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks-announce Science: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/science kazi: http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/admin/kazi/general
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participants (22)
-
aki -
Barrack Otieno -
Chris W. -
David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd -
Dickson Kimathi -
excuseme yespliz -
Gakuru Alex -
Job Njogu -
Joseph McDonald -
Josiah Mugambi -
maina martin -
Michuki Mwangi -
mike oketch -
Muniu Kariuki -
ndungu stephen -
Njoroge Tito -
Odhiambo ワシントン -
Paul Msava -
Phares Kariuki -
Solomon Mburu -
Steve Muchai -
Walubengo J