So finally, after all those years, Zain will be launching their 3G service next month. But it all seems all these plans are tied to CCK reducing licence fees for 3G specrtrum licences. I wonder what will happen if they do not, and thee are a lot of powerful players in the industry who ate counting on this. Never the less, I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less. And Zain, or Celtel had the opportunity to acquire a 3G license then and develop their markets the same way others did. Nevertheless, I think we should watch and see if this will have any bearing on product reliability and prices offered by other players. And their is the small matter of acquisition by Bharti Airtel, I am not sure where this leaves Zain's 3G plans. The new owners, known for targeting the 'lower end' of the market may as well decide the lower end of the market does not need 3G after all. And they will have come full-circle. It used to be the upper end of the market with KenCell back in 2001.
*"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."* some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history. On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:01 AM, Philip Musyoki <pmusyoki@gmail.com> wrote:
So finally, after all those years, Zain will be launching their 3G service next month. But it all seems all these plans are tied to CCK reducing licence fees for 3G specrtrum licences. I wonder what will happen if they do not, and thee are a lot of powerful players in the industry who ate counting on this. Never the less, I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less. And Zain, or Celtel had the opportunity to acquire a 3G license then and develop their markets the same way others did.
Nevertheless, I think we should watch and see if this will have any bearing on product reliability and prices offered by other players. And their is the small matter of acquisition by Bharti Airtel, I am not sure where this leaves Zain's 3G plans. The new owners, known for targeting the 'lower end' of the market may as well decide the lower end of the market does not need 3G after all. And they will have come full-circle. It used to be the upper end of the market with KenCell back in 2001.
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On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya <hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk>wrote:
*"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."*
some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history.
The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based on my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize. Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m. On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
Does this line of argument also point towards the guys who got a unified license recently should pay all cumulative costs for each category they got just like the Safcon and Zain had payed separately? Now that the regulators will have costs for licensing and review of mobile money systems, does it mean mpesa should be asked to pay those costs(backdated with inflationary adjustments)? The easy access of the existing operators into the 3G segment will only serve to grow the industry and give us "real" broadband countrywide. The CCK should follow the fundamentals on which its created and stop falling to political noise so they can effectively regulate the industry while representing the public goodwill. On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya <hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk>wrote:
*"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."*
some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history.
The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based on my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize.
Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m.
On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
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If I was Zain I would actually go for 4G at the same price ... atleast they would get value for their money ...... On 2 June 2010 12:29, Moses <mosenetk@gmail.com> wrote:
Does this line of argument also point towards the guys who got a unified license recently should pay all cumulative costs for each category they got just like the Safcon and Zain had payed separately? Now that the regulators will have costs for licensing and review of mobile money systems, does it mean mpesa should be asked to pay those costs(backdated with inflationary adjustments)? The easy access of the existing operators into the 3G segment will only serve to grow the industry and give us "real" broadband countrywide. The CCK should follow the fundamentals on which its created and stop falling to political noise so they can effectively regulate the industry while representing the public goodwill.
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya <hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk>wrote:
*"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."*
some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history.
The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based on my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize.
Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m.
On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
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Lest we continue throwing the alphabet soup, how many countries are live on LTE apart from Norway and Sweden? Secondly LTE is a very different way of doing business and operating, it's not something any company including Sprint and Teliasonera, wake up on morning and start deploying. My thoughts. Kiania On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 2:01 PM, Watson Kambo <wkwats@gmail.com> wrote:
If I was Zain I would actually go for 4G at the same price ... atleast they would get value for their money ......
On 2 June 2010 12:29, Moses <mosenetk@gmail.com> wrote:
Does this line of argument also point towards the guys who got a unified license recently should pay all cumulative costs for each category they got just like the Safcon and Zain had payed separately? Now that the regulators will have costs for licensing and review of mobile money systems, does it mean mpesa should be asked to pay those costs(backdated with inflationary adjustments)? The easy access of the existing operators into the 3G segment will only serve to grow the industry and give us "real" broadband countrywide. The CCK should follow the fundamentals on which its created and stop falling to political noise so they can effectively regulate the industry while representing the public goodwill.
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya <hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."
some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history.
The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based on my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize.
Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m.
On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
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-- [Asentric Consulting Ltd] If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth .... -Richest Man in Babylon
True David, but by the way things stand they will pay 25M for the 3G, which I think they are so late to deploy, then Safcom will beat them to 4G again with what ever price CCK offers then in Four years when they now want 4G CCK will tell them to pay the same price as Safcom did ... so Why not be the first ones to lay out the LTE network ... as a matter of fact even the 3G network still cannot run on their 2/2.5G ... technically they will be laying out a new network ... only that on the LTE platform its a whole new architecture including the end user equipment ... On 2 June 2010 14:31, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd < kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Lest we continue throwing the alphabet soup, how many countries are live on LTE apart from Norway and Sweden?
Secondly LTE is a very different way of doing business and operating, it's not something any company including Sprint and Teliasonera, wake up on morning and start deploying.
My thoughts.
Kiania
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 2:01 PM, Watson Kambo <wkwats@gmail.com> wrote:
If I was Zain I would actually go for 4G at the same price ... atleast they would get value for their money ......
On 2 June 2010 12:29, Moses <mosenetk@gmail.com> wrote:
Does this line of argument also point towards the guys who got a unified license recently should pay all cumulative costs for each category they
got
just like the Safcon and Zain had payed separately? Now that the regulators will have costs for licensing and review of mobile money systems, does it mean mpesa should be asked to pay those costs(backdated with inflationary adjustments)? The easy access of the existing operators into the 3G segment will only serve to grow the industry and give us "real" broadband countrywide. The CCK should follow the fundamentals on which its created and stop falling to political noise so they can effectively regulate the industry while representing the public goodwill.
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya <hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million.
That's
what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."
some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history.
The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based on my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize.
Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m.
On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
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-- Watson wanjohi kambo
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--
[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
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It's interesting to note that Safcom boasts as being the only operator to have a 3G platform in Kenya and soon they'll roll out 4G, yet there are places in Nairobi (such as South B) where 3G is not accessible. Maybe they should make the whole country enoy this service. Still on Zain, the govt appointed a taskforce to oversee the sale of Zain Kenya. Just wondering, suppose the Taskforce doesn't give a clean bill of health on sale (like what Gabon's govt did) of Zain Kenya to Bharti Airtel, will the sale be stopped, thus retaining Zain Kenya? I've aslo noticed when I pay bills to Zain Kenya, Celtel Kenya appears along the way. So we have Zain Kenya which is technically Celtel Kenya LTD? Zain Kenya Ltd 'doesn't' exist @ the Companies Registry, is it? On 3G or 4G, there is a need for Zain to focus on what the dominant player doesn't provide to the masses. The efficiency of these services need to create a conduicive environment for business and social development. I really wonder what is the essence of providing the same service that another company has perfected! Competition works well through innovations, though not the ultimate basis for leading. On 02/06/2010, Watson Kambo <wkwats@gmail.com> wrote:
True David, but by the way things stand they will pay 25M for the 3G, which I think they are so late to deploy, then Safcom will beat them to 4G again with what ever price CCK offers then in Four years when they now want 4G CCK will tell them to pay the same price as Safcom did ... so Why not be the first ones to lay out the LTE network ... as a matter of fact even the 3G network still cannot run on their 2/2.5G ... technically they will be laying out a new network ... only that on the LTE platform its a whole new architecture including the end user equipment ...
On 2 June 2010 14:31, David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd < kianiadee@gmail.com> wrote:
Lest we continue throwing the alphabet soup, how many countries are live on LTE apart from Norway and Sweden?
Secondly LTE is a very different way of doing business and operating, it's not something any company including Sprint and Teliasonera, wake up on morning and start deploying.
My thoughts.
Kiania
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 2:01 PM, Watson Kambo <wkwats@gmail.com> wrote:
If I was Zain I would actually go for 4G at the same price ... atleast they would get value for their money ......
On 2 June 2010 12:29, Moses <mosenetk@gmail.com> wrote:
Does this line of argument also point towards the guys who got a unified license recently should pay all cumulative costs for each category they
got
just like the Safcon and Zain had payed separately? Now that the regulators will have costs for licensing and review of mobile money systems, does it mean mpesa should be asked to pay those costs(backdated with inflationary adjustments)? The easy access of the existing operators into the 3G segment will only serve to grow the industry and give us "real" broadband countrywide. The CCK should follow the fundamentals on which its created and stop falling to political noise so they can effectively regulate the industry while representing the public goodwill.
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya <hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million.
That's
what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."
some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history.
The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based on my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize.
Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m.
On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
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[Asentric Consulting Ltd]
If a man has in himself the soul of a slave will he not become one no matter what his birth ....
-Richest Man in Babylon _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
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I dont understand ---- I thought Bharti already bought Zain - and Zain Kenya included - why are they selling Zain Kenya again ? The deal took place in the HQ Bahrain to acquire all Zain Telkoms - but remove the name Zain, because it belongs to the Zain Group of companies.
I think CCK should refund the $25million that was paid by safcom, and desist from charging such licensing fees - unless the goal is to protect the licensees from spurious competition. As we have seen, the high fee only serves to hinder competition - or, are Zain and Orange "spurious" competition? I also think that a pay per use model for levies could be fairer to all, than a once-off. If the innovator makes a killing, it's only fairer that CCK (GoK?) shares in it. On the other hand, if it's a bad deal, the company should not be punished for it. Olive trees are important. They represent everything that roots us, anchors us, identifies us and locates us in this world - whether it be belonging to a family, a community, a tribe, a nation, a religion or, most of all, a place called home. - Thomas Friedman - "The Lexus And The Olive Tree" ________________________________ From: Moses <mosenetk@gmail.com> To: Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Sent: Wed, June 2, 2010 4:29:59 AM Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Zain to Launch 3G Service in July Does this line of argument also point towards the guys who got a unified license recently should pay all cumulative costs for each category they got just like the Safcon and Zain had payed separately? Now that the regulators will have costs for licensing and review of mobile money systems, does it mean mpesa should be asked to pay those costs(backdated with inflationary adjustments)? The easy access of the existing operators into the 3G segment will only serve to grow the industry and give us "real" broadband countrywide. The CCK should follow the fundamentals on which its created and stop falling to political noise so they can effectively regulate the industry while representing the public goodwill. On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote: On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya <hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."
some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history.
The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based on my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize.
Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m.
On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
_______________________________________________
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What is the rationale for CCK charging $25m to acquire 3G? Is there a universal criteria for these charges or they are determined on as-in basis? If there is no justifiable rationale behind this, then Zain should not pay less than what Safaricom paid for 3G. Corrections are welcome. On 03/06/2010, Bernard Owuor <b_owuor@yahoo.com> wrote:
I think CCK should refund the $25million that was paid by safcom, and desist from charging such licensing fees - unless the goal is to protect the licensees from spurious competition. As we have seen, the high fee only serves to hinder competition - or, are Zain and Orange "spurious" competition?
I also think that a pay per use model for levies could be fairer to all, than a once-off. If the innovator makes a killing, it's only fairer that CCK (GoK?) shares in it. On the other hand, if it's a bad deal, the company should not be punished for it.
Olive trees are important. They represent everything that roots us, anchors us, identifies us and locates us in this world - whether it be belonging to a family, a community, a tribe, a nation, a religion or, most of all, a place called home. - Thomas Friedman - "The Lexus And The Olive Tree"
________________________________ From: Moses <mosenetk@gmail.com> To: Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Sent: Wed, June 2, 2010 4:29:59 AM Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Zain to Launch 3G Service in July
Does this line of argument also point towards the guys who got a unified license recently should pay all cumulative costs for each category they got just like the Safcon and Zain had payed separately? Now that the regulators will have costs for licensing and review of mobile money systems, does it mean mpesa should be asked to pay those costs(backdated with inflationary adjustments)? The easy access of the existing operators into the 3G segment will only serve to grow the industry and give us "real" broadband countrywide. The CCK should follow the fundamentals on which its created and stop falling to political noise so they can effectively regulate the industry while representing the public goodwill.
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya <hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."
some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history.
The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based on my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize.
Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m.
On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f...
------------
Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Solomon Mbũrũ Kamau ***************************************************** Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill! AND It is better to die in dignity than in the ignomity of ambiguous generosity! http://smiley2.wordpress.com http://mburu.sikika.co.ke
From a market stand point, what are the chances of YU, Zain, etc recouping the 25M? They cannot start charging the exorbitant rates Safcom had the privilege of charging for internet back then. Hell, even Safcom would have trouble recouping the same amount now (based on data alone, not Mpesa and other products)
The market has changed and the conditions that applied then dont apply now. I am with Bernad on this one - CCK should look for a more complex way of determining the fees rather than a once-all fee. On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 7:52 AM, Solomon Mburu Kamau <solo.mburu@gmail.com>wrote:
What is the rationale for CCK charging $25m to acquire 3G? Is there a universal criteria for these charges or they are determined on as-in basis?
If there is no justifiable rationale behind this, then Zain should not pay less than what Safaricom paid for 3G.
Corrections are welcome.
On 03/06/2010, Bernard Owuor <b_owuor@yahoo.com> wrote:
I think CCK should refund the $25million that was paid by safcom, and desist from charging such licensing fees - unless the goal is to protect the licensees from spurious competition. As we have seen, the high fee only serves to hinder competition - or, are Zain and Orange "spurious" competition?
I also think that a pay per use model for levies could be fairer to all, than a once-off. If the innovator makes a killing, it's only fairer that CCK (GoK?) shares in it. On the other hand, if it's a bad deal, the company should not be punished for it.
Olive trees are important. They represent everything that roots us, anchors us, identifies us and locates us in this world - whether it be belonging to a family, a community, a tribe, a nation, a religion or, most of all, a place called home. - Thomas Friedman - "The Lexus And The Olive Tree"
________________________________ From: Moses <mosenetk@gmail.com> To: Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Sent: Wed, June 2, 2010 4:29:59 AM Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Zain to Launch 3G Service in July
Does this line of argument also point towards the guys who got a unified license recently should pay all cumulative costs for each category they got just like the Safcon and Zain had payed separately? Now that the regulators will have costs for licensing and review of mobile money systems, does it mean mpesa should be asked to pay those costs(backdated with inflationary adjustments)? The easy access of the existing operators into the 3G segment will only serve to grow the industry and give us "real" broadband countrywide. The CCK should follow the fundamentals on which its created and stop falling to political noise so they can effectively regulate the industry while representing the public goodwill.
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya <hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."
some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history.
The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based
on
my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize.
Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m.
On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f...
------------
Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Solomon Mbũrũ Kamau
***************************************************** Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill!
AND
It is better to die in dignity than in the ignomity of ambiguous generosity!
http://smiley2.wordpress.com http://mburu.sikika.co.ke _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Interesting discussion I will not dwell on the argument whether CCK should reduce,charge or remove the licence fee or not. Convergence is a telecom industry reality,the new battlelines is between the telecommunication industry and the entertainment industry (Movies,online games,betting etc). So telecommunication industry should invest in high speed technologies 3G(IMT 2000) ,3G LTE going towards 4getc. Because the Moore's law will apply to the unforeseeable future.The demand for data is huge so far it stands at 10 exabytes per year (10 to the power of 18).People want more data and mobility.To achieve these two requirements you need platforms which are scalable and offering high speed connectivity Having said that there are also challenges which needs to be balanced e.g Commodotization Vs fast mover advantage Capital Expenditure Vs Innovation Government Regulation Vs De-regulation Adhoc cost cutting Vs Lean management (Unified oss/bss) And that is where Safcom wins they know what is happening and they adjust the strategy according to the environment.While the others sit back and whine and whine and whine.With alot of backing from skunkworks. Out there in the industry its man eat man......you either win or go home (like NBA playoffs) On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 9:41 AM, Mr. Lawi <mail2lawi@gmail.com> wrote:
From a market stand point, what are the chances of YU, Zain, etc recouping the 25M? They cannot start charging the exorbitant rates Safcom had the privilege of charging for internet back then. Hell, even Safcom would have trouble recouping the same amount now (based on data alone, not Mpesa and other products)
The market has changed and the conditions that applied then dont apply now. I am with Bernad on this one - CCK should look for a more complex way of determining the fees rather than a once-all fee.
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 7:52 AM, Solomon Mburu Kamau <solo.mburu@gmail.com>wrote:
What is the rationale for CCK charging $25m to acquire 3G? Is there a universal criteria for these charges or they are determined on as-in basis?
If there is no justifiable rationale behind this, then Zain should not pay less than what Safaricom paid for 3G.
Corrections are welcome.
On 03/06/2010, Bernard Owuor <b_owuor@yahoo.com> wrote:
I think CCK should refund the $25million that was paid by safcom, and desist from charging such licensing fees - unless the goal is to protect the licensees from spurious competition. As we have seen, the high fee only serves to hinder competition - or, are Zain and Orange "spurious" competition?
I also think that a pay per use model for levies could be fairer to all, than a once-off. If the innovator makes a killing, it's only fairer that CCK (GoK?) shares in it. On the other hand, if it's a bad deal, the company should not be punished for it.
Olive trees are important. They represent everything that roots us, anchors us, identifies us and locates us in this world - whether it be belonging to a family, a community, a tribe, a nation, a religion or, most of all, a place called home. - Thomas Friedman - "The Lexus And The Olive Tree"
________________________________ From: Moses <mosenetk@gmail.com> To: Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Sent: Wed, June 2, 2010 4:29:59 AM Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Zain to Launch 3G Service in July
Does this line of argument also point towards the guys who got a unified license recently should pay all cumulative costs for each category they got just like the Safcon and Zain had payed separately? Now that the regulators will have costs for licensing and review of mobile money systems, does it mean mpesa should be asked to pay those costs(backdated with inflationary adjustments)? The easy access of the existing operators into the 3G segment will only serve to grow the industry and give us "real" broadband countrywide. The CCK should follow the fundamentals on which its created and stop falling to political noise so they can effectively regulate the industry while representing the public goodwill.
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya <hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."
some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history.
The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based
on
my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize.
Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m.
On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f...
------------
Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Solomon Mbũrũ Kamau
***************************************************** Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill!
AND
It is better to die in dignity than in the ignomity of ambiguous generosity!
http://smiley2.wordpress.com http://mburu.sikika.co.ke _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
hehehe, I linke the man eat man analogy. But I would rather 'man eat fish'. lol! Lenya On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 6:20 PM, Joseph McDonald <mcdonaldoj@gmail.com> wrote:
Interesting discussion
I will not dwell on the argument whether CCK should reduce,charge or remove the licence fee or not.
Convergence is a telecom industry reality,the new battlelines is between the telecommunication industry and the entertainment industry (Movies,online games,betting etc).
So telecommunication industry should invest in high speed technologies 3G(IMT 2000) ,3G LTE going towards 4getc.
Because the Moore's law will apply to the unforeseeable future.The demand for data is huge so far it stands at 10 exabytes per year (10 to the power of 18).People want more data and mobility.To achieve these two requirements you need platforms which are scalable and offering high speed connectivity
Having said that there are also challenges which needs to be balanced e.g
Commodotization Vs fast mover advantage Capital Expenditure Vs Innovation Government Regulation Vs De-regulation Adhoc cost cutting Vs Lean management (Unified oss/bss)
And that is where Safcom wins they know what is happening and they adjust the strategy according to the environment.While the others sit back and whine and whine and whine.With alot of backing from skunkworks.
Out there in the industry its man eat man......you either win or go home (like NBA playoffs)
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 9:41 AM, Mr. Lawi <mail2lawi@gmail.com> wrote:
From a market stand point, what are the chances of YU, Zain, etc recouping the 25M? They cannot start charging the exorbitant rates Safcom had the privilege of charging for internet back then. Hell, even Safcom would have trouble recouping the same amount now (based on data alone, not Mpesa and other products)
The market has changed and the conditions that applied then dont apply now. I am with Bernad on this one - CCK should look for a more complex way of determining the fees rather than a once-all fee.
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 7:52 AM, Solomon Mburu Kamau <solo.mburu@gmail.com> wrote:
What is the rationale for CCK charging $25m to acquire 3G? Is there a universal criteria for these charges or they are determined on as-in basis?
If there is no justifiable rationale behind this, then Zain should not pay less than what Safaricom paid for 3G.
Corrections are welcome.
On 03/06/2010, Bernard Owuor <b_owuor@yahoo.com> wrote:
I think CCK should refund the $25million that was paid by safcom, and desist from charging such licensing fees - unless the goal is to protect the licensees from spurious competition. As we have seen, the high fee only serves to hinder competition - or, are Zain and Orange "spurious" competition?
I also think that a pay per use model for levies could be fairer to all, than a once-off. If the innovator makes a killing, it's only fairer that CCK (GoK?) shares in it. On the other hand, if it's a bad deal, the company should not be punished for it.
Olive trees are important. They represent everything that roots us, anchors us, identifies us and locates us in this world - whether it be belonging to a family, a community, a tribe, a nation, a religion or, most of all, a place called home. - Thomas Friedman - "The Lexus And The Olive Tree"
________________________________ From: Moses <mosenetk@gmail.com> To: Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Sent: Wed, June 2, 2010 4:29:59 AM Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Zain to Launch 3G Service in July
Does this line of argument also point towards the guys who got a unified license recently should pay all cumulative costs for each category they got just like the Safcon and Zain had payed separately? Now that the regulators will have costs for licensing and review of mobile money systems, does it mean mpesa should be asked to pay those costs(backdated with inflationary adjustments)? The easy access of the existing operators into the 3G segment will only serve to grow the industry and give us "real" broadband countrywide. The CCK should follow the fundamentals on which its created and stop falling to political noise so they can effectively regulate the industry while representing the public goodwill.
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya <hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> "I still think the fees should remain the same at USD 25 million. That's what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth less."
some time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. Personally, I belive license fees should be tied to market trends and not history.
The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based on my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize.
Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m.
On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
_______________________________________________
Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
>http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f...
------------
Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Solomon Mbũrũ Kamau
***************************************************** Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill!
AND
It is better to die in dignity than in the ignomity of ambiguous generosity!
http://smiley2.wordpress.com http://mburu.sikika.co.ke _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
CCK has issues. cant they do a installment kind of a payment system, let all pay $25 M but mdogo mdogo, this will allow the tel companies to invest more into tech rather than finding ways to get the$ 25 M so that they can pay the GOK. On Tue, Jun 8, 2010 at 10:11 AM, Anthony Lenya <tlensya@gmail.com> wrote:
hehehe,
I linke the man eat man analogy. But I would rather 'man eat fish'.
lol!
Lenya
On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 6:20 PM, Joseph McDonald <mcdonaldoj@gmail.com> wrote:
Interesting discussion
I will not dwell on the argument whether CCK should reduce,charge or remove the licence fee or not.
Convergence is a telecom industry reality,the new battlelines is between the telecommunication industry and the entertainment industry (Movies,online games,betting etc).
So telecommunication industry should invest in high speed technologies 3G(IMT 2000) ,3G LTE going towards 4getc.
Because the Moore's law will apply to the unforeseeable future.The demand for data is huge so far it stands at 10 exabytes per year (10 to the power of 18).People want more data and mobility.To achieve these two requirements you need platforms which are scalable and offering high speed connectivity
Having said that there are also challenges which needs to be balanced e.g
Commodotization Vs fast mover advantage Capital Expenditure Vs Innovation Government Regulation Vs De-regulation Adhoc cost cutting Vs Lean management (Unified oss/bss)
And that is where Safcom wins they know what is happening and they adjust the strategy according to the environment.While the others sit back and whine and whine and whine.With alot of backing from skunkworks.
Out there in the industry its man eat man......you either win or go home (like NBA playoffs)
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 9:41 AM, Mr. Lawi <mail2lawi@gmail.com> wrote:
From a market stand point, what are the chances of YU, Zain, etc
recouping
the 25M? They cannot start charging the exorbitant rates Safcom had the privilege of charging for internet back then. Hell, even Safcom would have trouble recouping the same amount now (based on data alone, not Mpesa and other products)
The market has changed and the conditions that applied then dont apply now. I am with Bernad on this one - CCK should look for a more complex way of determining the fees rather than a once-all fee.
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 7:52 AM, Solomon Mburu Kamau < solo.mburu@gmail.com> wrote:
What is the rationale for CCK charging $25m to acquire 3G? Is there a universal criteria for these charges or they are determined on as-in basis?
If there is no justifiable rationale behind this, then Zain should not pay less than what Safaricom paid for 3G.
Corrections are welcome.
On 03/06/2010, Bernard Owuor <b_owuor@yahoo.com> wrote:
I think CCK should refund the $25million that was paid by safcom, and desist from charging such licensing fees - unless the goal is to protect the licensees from spurious competition. As we have seen, the high fee
only
serves to hinder competition - or, are Zain and Orange "spurious" competition?
I also think that a pay per use model for levies could be fairer to all, than a once-off. If the innovator makes a killing, it's only fairer that CCK (GoK?) shares in it. On the other hand, if it's a bad deal, the company should not be punished for it.
Olive trees are important. They represent everything that roots us, anchors us, identifies us and locates us in this world - whether it be belonging to a family, a community, a tribe, a nation, a religion or, most of all, a place called home. - Thomas Friedman - "The Lexus And The Olive Tree"
________________________________ From: Moses <mosenetk@gmail.com> To: Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Sent: Wed, June 2, 2010 4:29:59 AM Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Zain to Launch 3G Service in July
Does this line of argument also point towards the guys who got a unified license recently should pay all cumulative costs for each category they got just like the Safcon and Zain had payed separately? Now that the regulators will have costs for licensing and review of mobile money systems, does it mean mpesa should be asked to pay those costs(backdated with inflationary adjustments)? The easy access of the existing operators into the 3G segment will only serve to grow the industry and give us "real" broadband countrywide. The CCK should follow the fundamentals on which its created and stop falling to political noise so they can effectively regulate the industry while representing the public goodwill.
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 11:24 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, Jun 2, 2010 at 10:35 AM, Humphrey Ngoiya < hngoiya@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> >"I still think the fees should remain the same at USD > 25 million. That's >what Safaricom paid, and with inflation the money is even worth
less."
> >some > time back the nokia 3310 cost around 15K, by your reasoning it should >now cost 20K after factoring in inflation. >Personally, I belive >license fees should be tied to market trends and not history. > The 3310 depreciates over time, a 3G license appreciates because, based on my understanding of how these things work, more Kenyans are getting connected and thus the holder of the license will most likely make more money this year than last year, until such a point that any Kenyan that can be connected is connected, at which point the revenue generated by the business activities allowed by the 3G license will stabilize.
Personally, I believe they should all pay the 25m.
On other matters, it would be interesting to know how this money is spent by CCK and/or the GoK.
_______________________________________________ >Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks >------------ >Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
>> http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... > ------------ >Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 >------------ >Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Solomon Mbũrũ Kamau
***************************************************** Man is a gregarious animal and enjoys agreement as cows will graze all the same way to the side of a hill!
AND
It is better to die in dignity than in the ignomity of ambiguous generosity!
http://smiley2.wordpress.com http://mburu.sikika.co.ke _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f...
------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f...
------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f...
------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
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-- Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths
3G Licence fee now rumoured to come down to $10M. http://bit.ly/aWczb6 Let's see what will cut.
Dear Sir/Madam, SANS is happy to invite you to our first Community SANS event in East Africa organized in partnership with K-Ninety East Africa Ltd. We will be offering FOR408: Computer Forensics Essentials in Nairobi, Kenya, 4-8 October. About Forensics 408: Computer Forensic Essentials - This course focuses on the critical knowledge that a computer forensic investigator must know to investigate computer crime incidents successfully. You will learn how computer forensic analysts focus on collecting and analyzing data from computer systems to track user-based activity that could be used internally or in civil/criminal litigation. This course covers the fundamental steps of the in-depth computer forensic methodology so that each student will have the complete qualifications to work as a computer forensic investigator in the field helping solve and fight crime. In addition to in-depth technical digital forensic, knowledge on Windows Digital Forensics (Windows XP through Windows 7 and Server 2008) you will be exposed to well known computer forensic tools so such as FTK, Registry Analyzers, FTK Imager, Prefetch Analyzers, and much more. *This course will be taught in English For more details and to register please visit: http://www.sans.org/info/60298 or contact Preston at info@k-90ea.com cell +254 722771478 Instructor Biography - Since he founded one of the first IT Security consultancies in Spain, Ismael Valenzuela has participated as a security professional in numerous international projects across EMEA, India and Australia in the last 10 years. He currently works as Global IT Security Manager for iSOFT Group Ltd., one of the world's largest providers of healthcare IT solutions with presence in more than 40 countries. Ismael's expertise includes security assessments, penetration testing, risk analysis, ISO 27001 implementation, security architecture design and review, IDS/IPS technology, traffic analysis, log correlation, incident handling and digital forensic analysis. Ismael also serves on the GIAC Advisory Board, and is an international instructor for the British Standard Institute (BSi). He holds a bachelor's degree in computer science from the University of Malaga (Spain), is certified in Business Administration, and holds several professional certifications including GCFA, GPEN, GWAPT, GCIA, CISSP, ITIL, CISM and IRCA 27001 Lead Auditor from Bureau Veritas UK. Training Venue - Nairobi Safari Club Lillian Towers, Koinange Street University Way P.O. Box: 43564 00100 Nairobi, Kenya About the Community SANS EMEA Program - The Community SANS format in EMEA (Europe, Middle East and Africa Region) offers the most popular SANS courses in your local community and in your local language. The classroom setting is small with fewer than 25 students. The instructors are pulled from the best of the local mentor program or qualified security experts who have passed SANS rigorous screening process called the murder boards. The course material is delivered over consecutive days, and the course content is the same as ones provided at a larger training event. In addition to the excellent courseware, not only will you be able to use the skills that you learned as soon as you return to the office, but you will be able to continue to network with colleagues in your community that you meet at the training. We look forward to welcoming you to Community SANS East Africa. If you have any inquiries about the course, please don't hesitate to contact Preston info@k-90ea.com ********************* SANS Training and Events Calendar - an easy way to see what opportunities are available to you during the coming months! The current calendar is now available for download from http://www.sans.org/info/7926. For another option, consider SANS' seven ways to Train Without Travel at: http://www.sans.org/info/28689. SANS' Webcasts are free live Web broadcasts that allow you to hear a knowledgeable speaker while viewing presentation slides that you download in advance. To learn more or to subscribe to our Webcast calendar go to http://www.sans.org/info/13271. Preston
participants (15)
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Anthony Lenya -
Bernard Owuor -
David Kiania | Asentric Consulting Ltd -
dennis kipruto -
Humphrey Ngoiya -
Joseph McDonald -
Moses -
Mr. Lawi -
ndungu stephen -
Peter Karunyu -
Philip Musyoki -
Preston -
Solomon Mburu Kamau -
Tony Likhanga -
Watson Kambo