I'd like to call on the moderators of this tech forum to create a separate mailing list/group that will be called the Technology Producers Group. I personally don't mind end consumers as they are the spenders and the final markets, but what I cannot stand are technologists-consumers anymore. They really irritate the annoyance out of me, I just may end up going down the wrong road with people which is counter-productive and not my intention in the first place. We have a few years to match the growth in the tech sectors, however an early start means a good preparation and foundation, IMHO. If you think that you want to be/or can be a potential Technology Producer for consumer or expert markets whether local or export, you should be part of this group. Whether software or hardware or whether specialist, you can be part of it. There's no rush as such, think about it and lets take this group forward. If anyone else out there wants to use this idea and make such a group, let me know as I'd like to join up. I'll make this a final post for a short while and will only be checking if there are any responses. Thank you. Rgds. :-)
No , no, but this lists are run on inferior FOSS technology, which will heavily impact on the TPG mailing list On 17 February 2012 15:25, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
I'd like to call on the moderators of this tech forum to create a separate mailing list/group that will be called the Technology Producers Group. I personally don't mind end consumers as they are the spenders and the final markets, but what I cannot stand are technologists-consumers anymore. They really irritate the annoyance out of me, I just may end up going down the wrong road with people which is counter-productive and not my intention in the first place.
We have a few years to match the growth in the tech sectors, however an early start means a good preparation and foundation, IMHO. If you think that you want to be/or can be a potential Technology Producer for consumer or expert markets whether local or export, you should be part of this group. Whether software or hardware or whether specialist, you can be part of it.
There's no rush as such, think about it and lets take this group forward. If anyone else out there wants to use this idea and make such a group, let me know as I'd like to join up. I'll make this a final post for a short while and will only be checking if there are any responses.
Thank you.
Rgds. :-)
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@Dennis, will host it away from the mailing list and onto a proper domain. Thnks for the correction. :-) On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 3:29 PM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
No , no, but this lists are run on inferior FOSS technology, which will heavily impact on the TPG mailing list
@Aki I would like to join. -- Many Thanks. Regards, http://about.me/cnongera Clement Ongera.
if you're doing it on a separate domain and mailing list then the moderators here have nothing to do, register the domain, start the forum maybe use this list for publicity or don't considering this here is run on open source crap by a moron On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 3:35 PM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
@Dennis, will host it away from the mailing list and onto a proper domain. Thnks for the correction. :-)
On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 3:29 PM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
No , no, but this lists are run on inferior FOSS technology, which will heavily impact on the TPG mailing list
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-- **Gitau
Wit the number of tech events going on, a nice line of business would be provisioning online/Youtube/streaming/Twitter journalism on them for free, with 3rd party ads paying for the bandwidth and relative costs. Kenya IS where it's at as far as Tech in Africa goes, but a lot of it goes undocumented. Just a thought. On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 8:46 PM, John Gitau <jgitau@gmail.com> wrote:
if you're doing it on a separate domain and mailing list then the moderators here have nothing to do, register the domain, start the forum maybe use this list for publicity or don't considering this here is run on open source crap by a moron
On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 3:35 PM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
@Dennis, will host it away from the mailing list and onto a proper domain. Thnks for the correction. :-)
On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 3:29 PM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
No , no, but this lists are run on inferior FOSS technology, which will heavily impact on the TPG mailing list
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-- **Gitau
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-- *William Warero* *** * *Skype:william.warero| Twitter:wwarero http://www.warero.wordpress.com I've got my head in the cloud...*
@John, I'm going to avoid making any "noise" here and will try my best to keep it brief: :-) 1) My comment on Open Source Crap created by morons was in response to that Firewall thread. And I'll not back off this and here's why. Just because some moron out there has not created a full Open Source project on the Network layer that others can download to install and use does not mean that a solution does not exist. I was pretty surprised when that thread went into the need for programming, when there is no such need. Even you appreciate the fact that it is better to certify on Cisco than on Open Source, yet I can tell you that Open Source like FreeBSD could have easily fixed 50% of the Firewall thread question. Within FreeBSd is a module called PF & ALTQ combined with DPI through the firewall that can handle everything a network needs, yet I did no see any response from the Open Source experts . Even worse, I've not seen any local Open Source experts create devices that can be used on the network layer, however others are ready to suggest boxed solutions as an alternative. I have total respect for FreeBSD as its what I used for many things including trying to create 16 port Ethernet IP DSLAMS for Multi-Tenant Internet distribution systems as a networking passion, however this is now almost 4-5 years ago.At that time I was at the same stage as many Open Source people on this list i.e what can a downloadable software offer me as a solution. Now I look back and am glad I choose another route. Read this paragraph carefully, relate to it and you will see why my comments. 2) Secondly, I must congratulate you on your CCIE achievement. Its no walk in the park and you are a very valuable asset to the network community in KE. For this I must commend you for your excellent efforts. Technology Producers Group will be honoured to have you on-board too. This also goes for all other network engineers, however you all have your own forum too. 3) I always give first option to Skunkworks KE, and this time too I gave it the first option of not only hosting but being the enabler of the new Group. However, I can also move it elsewhere if necessary. 4) If you read in my first posting on this thread, I wrote that any SOFTWARE/HARDWARE/SPECIALIST sectors are welcome to join the Technology Producers Group. This means for any local software development that is whether proprietary or foss, and on whatever language, frameworks are all welcome. What is not welcome is externally developed solutions/systems/software because they would not be able to fit in. Some thots and corrections welcome. :-) On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 8:46 PM, John Gitau <jgitau@gmail.com> wrote:
if you're doing it on a separate domain and mailing list then the moderators here have nothing to do, register the domain, start the forum maybe use this list for publicity or don't considering this here is run on open source crap by a moron
@Clement, welcome. :-) @William, thank you for the suggestion. As part of the Technology Producers Group outlook, what would you recommend the way forward on your proposed idea. Lets discuss if you have sometime. :-)
On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 11:57 PM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
@John, I'm going to avoid making any "noise" here and will try my best to keep it brief: :-)
1) My comment on Open Source Crap created by morons was in response to that Firewall thread. And I'll not back off this and here's why. Just because some moron out there has not created a full Open Source project on the
Some morons have, the solutions exist and they do work.
Network layer that others can download to install and use does not mean that a solution does not exist. I was pretty surprised when that thread went into the need for programming, when there is no such need.
You took the thread there, remember?
the fact that it is better to certify on Cisco than on Open Source, yet I can tell you that Open Source like FreeBSD could have easily fixed 50% of the Firewall thread question. Within FreeBSd is a module called PF & ALTQ combined with DPI through the firewall that can handle everything a network needs, yet I did no see any response from the Open Source experts . Even
Listen to yourself. You started bashing open source, the thread went downhill then turn around and say you didn't see responses from the "Open Source experts"? Do I need to post the entire thread here for you to read again? And are they obliged to answer any way? To make you happy, perhaps?
worse, I've not seen any local Open Source experts create devices that can be used on the network layer, however others are ready to suggest boxed
Maybe you haven't looked hard enough.
solutions as an alternative. I have total respect for FreeBSD as its what I used for many things including trying to create 16 port Ethernet IP DSLAMS for Multi-Tenant Internet distribution systems as a networking passion, however this is now almost 4-5 years ago.At that time I was at the same stage as many Open Source people on this list i.e what can a downloadable
You have no idea how many on this list have been there, done that, and contributed back. Doesn't have to be in terms of code, but helpful feedback, bug catching etc...and are still doing it. Great, now move on and let those who are still in that stage go through it without insulting them. Maybe some of us morons will never move past it to where you are, but we reserve the right not to. BR S
Sorry list, shouldn't have posted this. But Aki's insult really got to me, and I've had a very long day and night. Time to go to sleep. Sorry if I got personal, but I took that insult personally as well. BR S On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 1:56 AM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 11:57 PM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
@John, I'm going to avoid making any "noise" here and will try my best to keep it brief: :-)
1) My comment on Open Source Crap created by morons was in response to that Firewall thread. And I'll not back off this and here's why. Just because some moron out there has not created a full Open Source project on the
Some morons have, the solutions exist and they do work.
Network layer that others can download to install and use does not mean that a solution does not exist. I was pretty surprised when that thread went into the need for programming, when there is no such need.
You took the thread there, remember?
the fact that it is better to certify on Cisco than on Open Source, yet I can tell you that Open Source like FreeBSD could have easily fixed 50% of the Firewall thread question. Within FreeBSd is a module called PF & ALTQ combined with DPI through the firewall that can handle everything a network needs, yet I did no see any response from the Open Source experts . Even
Listen to yourself. You started bashing open source, the thread went downhill then turn around and say you didn't see responses from the "Open Source experts"? Do I need to post the entire thread here for you to read again? And are they obliged to answer any way? To make you happy, perhaps?
worse, I've not seen any local Open Source experts create devices that can be used on the network layer, however others are ready to suggest boxed
Maybe you haven't looked hard enough.
solutions as an alternative. I have total respect for FreeBSD as its what I used for many things including trying to create 16 port Ethernet IP DSLAMS for Multi-Tenant Internet distribution systems as a networking passion, however this is now almost 4-5 years ago.At that time I was at the same stage as many Open Source people on this list i.e what can a downloadable
You have no idea how many on this list have been there, done that, and contributed back. Doesn't have to be in terms of code, but helpful feedback, bug catching etc...and are still doing it.
Great, now move on and let those who are still in that stage go through it without insulting them. Maybe some of us morons will never move past it to where you are, but we reserve the right not to.
BR S
-- This message represents the official view of the voices in my head.
Steve stop apologizing,,this guy started name calling here..i also took it personally,,infact for me he also called me a heckler..and like i said he has nothing to show for "knowing all".. always blowing his own trumpet and bashing! I rest my case.. On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 2:05 AM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com> wrote:
Sorry list, shouldn't have posted this. But Aki's insult really got to me, and I've had a very long day and night. Time to go to sleep. Sorry if I got personal, but I took that insult personally as well.
BR S
On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 1:56 AM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 11:57 PM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
@John, I'm going to avoid making any "noise" here and will try my best to keep it brief: :-)
1) My comment on Open Source Crap created by morons was in response to that Firewall thread. And I'll not back off this and here's why. Just because some moron out there has not created a full Open Source project on the
Some morons have, the solutions exist and they do work.
Network layer that others can download to install and use does not mean that a solution does not exist. I was pretty surprised when that thread went into the need for programming, when there is no such need.
You took the thread there, remember?
the fact that it is better to certify on Cisco than on Open Source, yet I can tell you that Open Source like FreeBSD could have easily fixed 50% of the Firewall thread question. Within FreeBSd is a module called PF & ALTQ combined with DPI through the firewall that can handle everything a network needs, yet I did no see any response from the Open Source experts . Even
Listen to yourself. You started bashing open source, the thread went downhill then turn around and say you didn't see responses from the "Open Source experts"? Do I need to post the entire thread here for you to read again? And are they obliged to answer any way? To make you happy, perhaps?
worse, I've not seen any local Open Source experts create devices that can be used on the network layer, however others are ready to suggest boxed
Maybe you haven't looked hard enough.
solutions as an alternative. I have total respect for FreeBSD as its what I used for many things including trying to create 16 port Ethernet IP DSLAMS for Multi-Tenant Internet distribution systems as a networking passion, however this is now almost 4-5 years ago.At that time I was at the same stage as many Open Source people on this list i.e what can a downloadable
You have no idea how many on this list have been there, done that, and contributed back. Doesn't have to be in terms of code, but helpful feedback, bug catching etc...and are still doing it.
Great, now move on and let those who are still in that stage go through it without insulting them. Maybe some of us morons will never move past it to where you are, but we reserve the right not to.
BR S
-- This message represents the official view of the voices in my head. _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke ------------ List info, subscribe/unsubscribe http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------
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@Maina, one of the best things I like about being Anonymous is that you can write such things and we will not have an on line fight. What my achievements are or are not have no significant bearing on any postings, they don't even put food on any listers plates here. Am just your average online skunksworks KE member. :-) Now that you commented on this thread, if you are interested, what part will you play in the Technology Producers Group? Rgds. On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 8:00 AM, maina <dmaishe@gmail.com> wrote:
Steve stop apologizing,,this guy started name calling here..i also took it personally,,infact for me he also called me a heckler..and like i said he has nothing to show for "knowing all".. always blowing his own trumpet and bashing!
@Steve, I'm going to respect your opinion and you've also got to respect mine. I've known you on this list as some of the few and best knowledgeable people on the network layer. Until you make the jump from "User and Consumer of Open Source" to "Creator on Open Source", we will keep going back and forth, and following the protests about noisy and hijacked threads, lets keep this one clean. 1) In a nutshell this is what the Technology Producers Group is about. We want to separate the Users from the Creators. And you are most welcome, as your knowledge and skills are quite important to where this group goes. As an example, you also know that 99% of all the boxed NTM, IDS devices are based on Open Source. All that the manufacturers/creators of these boxed devices did was to create a proprietary algorithm or sequence that makes the boxes perform differently. Given the level of expertise that is within the KE circles on Network Layer & Open Source, what is stopping local production of NTM/IDS devices for not only local sale but export? We need a development plan and a focus to match what Smart Companies will do. Whether you or I can get involved commercially or not, lets have some platform to try and achieve this because it is very very possible. Are you saying that given your network knowledge, you cannot create a device that fulfills the goals of IP Traffic Management for Egde Networks? We can easily do this, just going by our experiences and knowledge on the layer. 2) @John Doe posted a very interesting thread on his internet problems. Partly you and me and other Network layer specialists are to blame for the current bad situation in the Data Sector. So we have all this knowledge and experience, know what high standards are required, yet some of our Data Networks are running in pre-historic internet times? This is where the Technology Producers Group is going to change things. I see it as a platform in the future that can convince investors that there are people in KE who can turn around the data sector very easily. If they are able to fund the STMs and Last Miles and see profitability of such, TPG can turn around the current situation. These are some of the ideas as we go forward. :-) Rgds.
On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 8:05 AM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
@Steve, I'm going to respect your opinion and you've also got to respect mine. I've known you on this list as some of the few and best knowledgeable people on the network layer. Until you make the jump from "User and Consumer of Open Source" to "Creator on Open Source", we will keep going back and
Like I said, I don't have to do anything to make you happy. We cannot all be "creators", at least not all at the same time. Maybe I will be one day, but as I graduate into a smarter "user and consumer" and gain more experience and knowledge, this list is one way I learn every day. Most of the time by just reading because I don't always have answers (heck, I rarely do). Insulting others for being at the level they're at is not the big stick that will get us there. Respect others too (not just their opinions).
forth, and following the protests about noisy and hijacked threads, lets keep this one clean.
1) In a nutshell this is what the Technology Producers Group is about. We want to separate the Users from the Creators. And you are most welcome, as
"We" want to separate? I know I don't. Who else does, show of hands? And how are the "users and consumers" ever going to get where you're convinced they have to if your answer to the "problem" is to separate the more knowledgeable who they can share ideas with?
your knowledge and skills are quite important to where this group goes. As an example, you also know that 99% of all the boxed NTM, IDS devices are based on Open Source. All that the manufacturers/creators of these boxed devices did was to create a proprietary algorithm or sequence that makes the boxes perform differently. Given the level of expertise that is within the KE circles on Network Layer & Open Source, what is stopping local production of NTM/IDS devices for not only local sale but export? We need a development plan and a focus to match what Smart Companies will do. Whether you or I can get involved commercially or not, lets have some platform to try and achieve this because it is very very possible. Are you saying that given your network knowledge, you cannot create a device that fulfills the goals of IP
If by "creating" you mean re-inventing the wheel, then according to you I can't and I don't see why I must. I make smart use of what's available, share the experience I gain, and I always hope that in the process I may come up with something new some day. If I don't, so be it.
Traffic Management for Egde Networks? We can easily do this, just going by our experiences and knowledge on the layer.
2) @John Doe posted a very interesting thread on his internet problems. Partly you and me and other Network layer specialists are to blame for the current bad situation in the Data Sector. So we have all this knowledge and experience, know what high standards are required, yet some of our Data Networks are running in pre-historic internet times? This is where the Technology Producers Group is going to change things. I see it as a platform in the future that can convince investors that there are people in KE who can turn around the data sector very easily. If they are able to fund
The problem is not the technology. It's poor business practices and ethics, bad attitudes, lack of passion to do things right, and failing to put customers first. Nothing anyone creates will change anything without a change of mindset. BR, S
@Steve, I'd like you to share a good laugh with me online as we get on with the weekend. I'm in my artistic mode now, so here goes but will try to be brief. :-)))) You, me and some others on this list have a lot in common thinking. Remember I never wrote that you were a moron, all I wrote was that the people out there who create Open Source/Free Software are the morons because well we end up becoming "users and consumers", right? Because I understand software development well enough to a certain point, I knew what I was writing. You understand the ISP sector very well and have written your comments below. Now am going to put you in my shoes based on your comments below which I've set to bold and highlighted, for the sake of some humour :: :-))) On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 10:24 AM, Steve Muchai <smuchai@gmail.com> wrote:
(.....)
2) @John Doe posted a very interesting thread on his internet problems. Partly you and me and other Network layer specialists are to blame for
the
current bad situation in the Data Sector. So we have all this knowledge and experience, know what high standards are required, yet some of our Data Networks are running in pre-historic internet times? This is where the Technology Producers Group is going to change things. I see it as a platform in the future that can convince investors that there are people in KE who can turn around the data sector very easily. If they are able to fund
*The problem is not the technology. It's poor business practices and ethics, bad attitudes, lack of passion to do things right, and failing to put customers first. Nothing anyone creates will change anything without a change of mindset.*
BR, S
ISP1 to @Steve>You have just insulted our multi-million KSH investments sector. Who do you think you are and what makes you think your are smarter than us? Do we not know how to run our own businesses? We are educated, we have customer care centres, we have support lines, we have spent millions on renovations and new technologies. We pay our staff well and we know what we are doing. How dare you accuse us of poor business practises and ethics, bad attitudes, lack of passion to do things right and failing to put customers first!! ISP2 to @Steve>What is all this name calling or even insulting people? How dare you even point a finger at us!! You will teach us nothing, so unless you have something new to tell us, just keep to yourself. And stop pretending that you know anything. Its people like you who come online and create all sorts of problems on mailing lists. We have many who are already complaining. Useless fellow!! ISP3 >CLAP...CLAP..CLAP...YAHOOO...YAHOOO! ISP3 to @Steve> Who are you?? Show us some tangible evidence of your achievements which we know you have none. Who are you to tell us anything? You are totally useless! @Steve to ISPs>Hmmm........ Some months later, What @Aki and @Steve started on a mailing list ended up become the standard. All forums died out due to lack of postings and contributions. All that was left was classified queries.
A posting for the Technology Producers Group. ( Reposting, as almost 3 years ago I posted this. ) *A sample summary case for re-inventing the wheel :* Category : Network Threat Management & Intrusion Detection Systems Devices Sub-Category : Specialized High Tech Industry Target Markets : Small to Large Business Companies Turnover Revenues : *1,000,000-USD per 5000 devices* for the small business company segment. *5,000,000-USD per 5000 devices* for the large business company segment Base System : Open Source Based, Proprietary implementation of core engine. Physical Dimensions : Same as those of boxed edge devices *- Some Local Business Impacts* - Creation of a small sized Smart Company. - Creation of an design and production line. - Creation of support facility. - Creation of Robotic & AI assembly line. - In house testing centre - In house certification centre - A strong possibility of a semi-conductor assembly facility on base components - Creation of Innovative methods and technologies to increase production facilities efficiencies and costs cutting *- A few of the benefits to a country:* - One a cycle of 5000 unit devices, between 1million - 5million USD of saved foreign exchange - Innovation at design, assembly and post post-production. - Smarter Tech industries and Companies, creation of specialised skills. - Revenues inflows when exports take place, depending on external markets Fill in the blanks, get a financial analyst to do the input/output figures versus investments/returns. Re-inventing the wheel pays off big time when the investments match the profitability/markets. Question is, do the skills to create exist? Yes they do on marketing, sales, property management, finance, legal etc. But without the core engine, the devices cannot even take off because we don't want to re-invent the wheel. Some thots. :-)
A posting for the Technology Producers Group. Semi-Conductors, incase you did know this. *How do I create a prototype* - Prototyping is much easier now than the 80s or 90s and can be very expensive. You can choose Intel, AD or Texas Instruments. There are also a number of semiconductor manufacturers in the Far East but here you must know what you are doing and which semiconductor to use. Anyway, say for example you are an Open Source expert and are looking at creating the prototype say for the NTM/IDS devices. Most of the time, embedded devices will work but you don't need a full-fledged computer hardware type system. To run an embedded version of your workable OS, you already have a full semi-conductor chipset that you can build on. - Watch the video from Texas Instruments on the ARM processors and how much they have done for Open Source Technology Producers to not only get started quickly but also build within their tools. http://www.ti.com/lsds/ti/dsp/arm.page?DCMP=TIHomeTracking&HQS=Other+OT+home... . Watch the video on the page link. There is a lot of information that can help you build complete systems. - Remember that many semi-conductor manufacturers have a batch order of a 1000pcs or also known as 1K. This is very important, as Texas Instruments allows you to purchase single processors for prototyping. Others do not offer such. - They also have excellent evaluation kits that make you prototype development much easier. - Depending on what you need to create, you may have to shop around other places because prototyping costs can easily shoot up and also get complex. When buying just the semi-conductors from different manufacturers can place serious delays in design work. - Forget about buying micro-motherboards/ram/cpu etc as they will increase your input costs when you want to build embedded systems. Go the semiconductor route.
This is something I have been keeping an eye on and I think will be of great interest $25 computers http://www.raspberrypi.org/faqs ----- Original Message ----- | From: "aki" <aki275@gmail.com> | To: "Skunkworks Mailing List" <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> | Sent: Sunday, February 19, 2012 11:13:19 PM | Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Technology Producers Group | A posting for the Technology Producers Group. Semi-Conductors, incase | you did know this. | How do I create a prototype | - Prototyping is much easier now than the 80s or 90s and can be very | expensive. You can choose Intel, AD or Texas Instruments. There are | also a number of semiconductor manufacturers in the Far East but | here you must know what you are doing and which semiconductor to | use. Anyway, say for example you are an Open Source expert and are | looking at creating the prototype say for the NTM/IDS devices. Most | of the time, embedded devices will work but you don't need a | full-fledged computer hardware type system. To run an embedded | version of your workable OS, you already have a full semi-conductor | chipset that you can build on. | - Watch the video from Texas Instruments on the ARM processors and | how much they have done for Open Source Technology Producers to not | only get started quickly but also build within their tools. | http://www.ti.com/lsds/ti/dsp/arm.page?DCMP=TIHomeTracking&HQS=Other+OT+home... | . Watch the video on the page link. There is a lot of information | that can help you build complete systems. | - Remember that many semi-conductor manufacturers have a batch order | of a 1000pcs or also known as 1K. This is very important, as Texas | Instruments allows you to purchase single processors for | prototyping. Others do not offer such. | - They also have excellent evaluation kits that make you prototype | development much easier. | - Depending on what you need to create, you may have to shop around | other places because prototyping costs can easily shoot up and also | get complex. When buying just the semi-conductors from different | manufacturers can place serious delays in design work. | - Forget about buying micro-motherboards/ram/cpu etc as they will | increase your input costs when you want to build embedded systems. | Go the semiconductor route. | _______________________________________________ | Skunkworks mailing list | Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke | ------------ | List info, subscribe/unsubscribe | http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks | ------------ | Skunkworks Rules | http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 | ------------ | Other services @ http://my.co.ke
KPLC monitoring & creation of Wiki type layout project has been moved to this thread.
participants (8)
-
aki -
Clement Ongera -
Dennis Kioko -
John Gitau -
maina -
Steve Muchai -
Steve Obbayi -
William Warero