Computer Science Curriculum Development
Hello techies, I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program. Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated. Muchas gracias, Me.
Some interns at my place of work, fresh from campus, didn't know how to install centos. They also didnt know that one can install virtualbox and install centos on top of it without touching the guest windows 7, made me rather sad coz I assumed these were basic skills. On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Peter - thats because they are not I.T graduates.. Computer Science is more of the fundamentals behind the tools and not necessarily usage of tools like in I.T courses.. stop wasting your sadness! On 21 February 2011 17:48, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Some interns at my place of work, fresh from campus, didn't know how to install centos. They also didnt know that one can install virtualbox and install centos on top of it without touching the guest windows 7, made me rather sad coz I assumed these were basic skills.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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-- Behind Google Chrome! <http://www.google.com/googlebooks/chrome/big_00.html>
Well, here are my suggestions, They should teach students on the applications of the Math they do in the design and analysis of computing systems. Most of the times its done in separate totally unrelated classes leaving the student with absolutely no use of them unless they go ahead and try to read materials that relate the two on their own. Or at least they should hint to the students, that they should read more to know how to relate the two. Memorizing the complexities of all sorting algorithms and reproducing them for an exam and then passing is totally is a misconception of understanding. Being able to determine the complexity of a random algorithm is what is of essence in the overall object. I hope I make some sense. They should also set questions from real world examples that will require engaged thinking and interesting problem solving. This will prepare the students to design applications that scale well and compete with world leading standards. On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 10:34 PM, Andrew Wachira <washirah@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter - thats because they are not I.T graduates.. Computer Science is more of the fundamentals behind the tools and not necessarily usage of tools like in I.T courses.. stop wasting your sadness!
On 21 February 2011 17:48, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Some interns at my place of work, fresh from campus, didn't know how to install centos. They also didnt know that one can install virtualbox and install centos on top of it without touching the guest windows 7, made me rather sad coz I assumed these were basic skills.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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-- Behind Google Chrome!<http://www.google.com/googlebooks/chrome/big_00.html>
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Solomon Kariri, Software Developer, Cell: +254736 729 450 Skype: solomonkariri
Solomon.. I think your points are the best so far. I remember hearing from some professor [not computer science] during orientation that the university is a place where you come to learn, not to be taught. And I never could agree more with her. What we are looking for here is what the uni could possibly do to instill this attitude into its students, rather than teach students how to do this, that and the other. Perhaps more extensive research would do. I noticed two kinds of students in uni. One kind is the type that thirsts after knowledge, always seeking to know more and having a curious mind. The other kind was the type that when confronted with a problem, they wouldn't bother trying to solve it coz they "haven't been taught how to solve that one". The second type would think that the first type was brainier, which made it worse, because rather than try and tackle the said problem, they would seek assistance form the first kind, who would be busy researching on something else and not having time to help. The second type would then walk away sad, accusing the first type of being too proud to assist. I believe that the university should be a place where people are taught to have that first type's attitude towards issues. Perhaps sharing your worst experiences with interns would also bring to light the various deficiencies our CS curricula have, then we could try and see what countermeasures would be appropriate to handle the problems identified. Me. On 21 February 2011 23:10, solomon kariri <solomonkariri@gmail.com> wrote:
Well, here are my suggestions, They should teach students on the applications of the Math they do in the design and analysis of computing systems. Most of the times its done in separate totally unrelated classes leaving the student with absolutely no use of them unless they go ahead and try to read materials that relate the two on their own. Or at least they should hint to the students, that they should read more to know how to relate the two. Memorizing the complexities of all sorting algorithms and reproducing them for an exam and then passing is totally is a misconception of understanding. Being able to determine the complexity of a random algorithm is what is of essence in the overall object. I hope I make some sense. They should also set questions from real world examples that will require engaged thinking and interesting problem solving. This will prepare the students to design applications that scale well and compete with world leading standards.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 10:34 PM, Andrew Wachira <washirah@gmail.com>wrote:
Peter - thats because they are not I.T graduates.. Computer Science is more of the fundamentals behind the tools and not necessarily usage of tools like in I.T courses.. stop wasting your sadness!
On 21 February 2011 17:48, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Some interns at my place of work, fresh from campus, didn't know how to install centos. They also didnt know that one can install virtualbox and install centos on top of it without touching the guest windows 7, made me rather sad coz I assumed these were basic skills.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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-- Behind Google Chrome!<http://www.google.com/googlebooks/chrome/big_00.html>
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Solomon Kariri,
Software Developer, Cell: +254736 729 450 Skype: solomonkariri
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
They should use modern texts to ground the basics. Most modern text books come with modern applications exercises and scenario. ________________________________ From: Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com> To: Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Sent: Mon, February 21, 2011 11:45:55 PM Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Computer Science Curriculum Development Solomon.. I think your points are the best so far. I remember hearing from some professor [not computer science] during orientation that the university is a place where you come to learn, not to be taught. And I never could agree more with her. What we are looking for here is what the uni could possibly do to instill this attitude into its students, rather than teach students how to do this, that and the other. Perhaps more extensive research would do. I noticed two kinds of students in uni. One kind is the type that thirsts after knowledge, always seeking to know more and having a curious mind. The other kind was the type that when confronted with a problem, they wouldn't bother trying to solve it coz they "haven't been taught how to solve that one". The second type would think that the first type was brainier, which made it worse, because rather than try and tackle the said problem, they would seek assistance form the first kind, who would be busy researching on something else and not having time to help. The second type would then walk away sad, accusing the first type of being too proud to assist. I believe that the university should be a place where people are taught to have that first type's attitude towards issues. Perhaps sharing your worst experiences with interns would also bring to light the various deficiencies our CS curricula have, then we could try and see what countermeasures would be appropriate to handle the problems identified. Me. On 21 February 2011 23:10, solomon kariri <solomonkariri@gmail.com> wrote: Well, here are my suggestions,
They should teach students on the applications of the Math they do in the design and analysis of computing systems. Most of the times its done in separate totally unrelated classes leaving the student with absolutely no use of them unless they go ahead and try to read materials that relate the two on their own. Or at least they should hint to the students, that they should read more to know how to relate the two. Memorizing the complexities of all sorting algorithms and reproducing them for an exam and then passing is totally is a misconception of understanding. Being able to determine the complexity of a random algorithm is what is of essence in the overall object. I hope I make some sense. They should also set questions from real world examples that will require engaged thinking and interesting problem solving. This will prepare the students to design applications that scale well and compete with world leading standards.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 10:34 PM, Andrew Wachira <washirah@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter - thats because they are not I.T graduates.. Computer Science is more of the fundamentals behind the tools and not necessarily usage of tools like in I.T courses.. stop wasting your sadness!
On 21 February 2011 17:48, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Some interns at my place of work, fresh from campus, didn't know how to install centos. They also didnt know that one can install virtualbox and install centos on top of it without touching the guest windows 7, made me rather sad coz I assumed these were basic skills.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>
wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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-- Behind Google Chrome!
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Solomon Kariri,
Software Developer, Cell: +254736 729 450 Skype: solomonkariri
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
i feel lecturerers r incompetent the dont know even of the latest technologies if you doubting me go ask abt android os u r be more saddened. the syllabus shud be reviewed atleast after every one year and specialization be encouraged on the third year of study.im garduate in computer science bt of what i was taught only 10 %apply in the market the rest i learn t by maself On 2/22/11, Bernard Owuor <b_owuor@yahoo.com> wrote:
They should use modern texts to ground the basics.
Most modern text books come with modern applications exercises and scenario.
________________________________ From: Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com> To: Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Sent: Mon, February 21, 2011 11:45:55 PM Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Computer Science Curriculum Development
Solomon.. I think your points are the best so far.
I remember hearing from some professor [not computer science] during orientation that the university is a place where you come to learn, not to be taught. And I never could agree more with her. What we are looking for here is what the uni could possibly do to instill this attitude into its students, rather than teach students how to do this, that and the other. Perhaps more extensive research would do.
I noticed two kinds of students in uni. One kind is the type that thirsts after knowledge, always seeking to know more and having a curious mind. The other kind was the type that when confronted with a problem, they wouldn't bother trying to solve it coz they "haven't been taught how to solve that one". The second type would think that the first type was brainier, which made it worse, because rather than try and tackle the said problem, they would seek assistance form the first kind, who would be busy researching on something else and not having time to help. The second type would then walk away sad, accusing the first type of being too proud to assist. I believe that the university should be a place where people are taught to have that first type's attitude towards issues.
Perhaps sharing your worst experiences with interns would also bring to light the various deficiencies our CS curricula have, then we could try and see what countermeasures would be appropriate to handle the problems identified.
Me.
On 21 February 2011 23:10, solomon kariri <solomonkariri@gmail.com> wrote:
Well, here are my suggestions,
They should teach students on the applications of the Math they do in the design and analysis of computing systems. Most of the times its done in separate totally unrelated classes leaving the student with absolutely no use of them unless they go ahead and try to read materials that relate the two on their own. Or at least they should hint to the students, that they should read more to know how to relate the two. Memorizing the complexities of all sorting algorithms and reproducing them for an exam and then passing is totally is a misconception of understanding. Being able to determine the complexity of a random algorithm is what is of essence in the overall object. I hope I make some sense. They should also set questions from real world examples that will require engaged thinking and interesting problem solving. This will prepare the students to design applications that scale well and compete with world leading standards.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 10:34 PM, Andrew Wachira <washirah@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter - thats because they are not I.T graduates.. Computer Science is more of the fundamentals behind the tools and not necessarily usage of tools like in I.T courses.. stop wasting your sadness!
On 21 February 2011 17:48, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Some interns at my place of work, fresh from campus, didn't know how to install centos. They also didnt know that one can install virtualbox and install centos on top of it without touching the guest windows 7, made me rather sad coz I assumed these were basic skills.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>
wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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-- Behind Google Chrome!
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-- Solomon Kariri,
Software Developer, Cell: +254736 729 450 Skype: solomonkariri
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Regards Mabeya Seme Conseray +254 724 204 543
While the teaching of technology specific stuff is pretty much being short sighted, theres something that comes up, lecturers may have the knowledge but imparting it to their students becomes the daunting task and as such the student comes off saying the lecturer is incompetent. Something else could be that, the course outline and what the lecturer "teaches" are in compete contrast, come examination day and you can guess what happens especially if the lecturer decides to ignore the syllabus [this has happened to me once] on the pretext that what they are teaching is based on the "Kenyan" market. In very few words, the lecturer and student should be sailing in the same boat following the same route [syllabus], this way alteration of the syllabus means a new direction. With respect of the syllabus, having it reviewed periodically to incorporate practicality of whats taught as well as encourage research would be a better option.
@simon - spot on. Thanks and Regards, Erick Njenga Nyachwaya, M: +254-725-008-790 <http://www.facebook.com/ErickNjenga> <http://www.twitter.com/ErickNjenga>
Andrew ...exactly my point.... On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 10:34 PM, Andrew Wachira <washirah@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter - thats because they are not I.T graduates.. Computer Science is more of the fundamentals behind the tools and not necessarily usage of tools like in I.T courses.. stop wasting your sadness!
On 21 February 2011 17:48, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Some interns at my place of work, fresh from campus, didn't know how to install centos. They also didnt know that one can install virtualbox and install centos on top of it without touching the guest windows 7, made me rather sad coz I assumed these were basic skills.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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-- Behind Google Chrome!<http://www.google.com/googlebooks/chrome/big_00.html>
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Regards, Kamiru Mwangi, 0721792419 Skype: samuel.kamiru
My brief views on this: - The curriculum could be leaner (see the UoN-SCI course bronchure, available at the reception) - The end result of the programme is largely up to an individual -- At UoN-SCI, there was (I suppose this is still the case) sufficient literature (books) for any student with the intention of empowering self in useful CS skills. -- I actually found a course like Automata actually useful (Did some reading after classes) - A missing element "might" have been lack of pulse with the "CS in practice". I suppose first years should be baptized with the fire of skunkworks or similar communities or the experiences of past students instead. (Maybe Phares can arrange to have meetups within campuses - there is more room) --- Also, since universities are keen on keeping down costs, it is only practical that labs run on open source (or free) operating systems - UoN felt like another enterprise stuck with Windows. On 2/24/11, Kamiru Mwangi Samuel <samuel.kamiru@gmail.com> wrote:
Andrew ...exactly my point....
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 10:34 PM, Andrew Wachira <washirah@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter - thats because they are not I.T graduates.. Computer Science is more of the fundamentals behind the tools and not necessarily usage of tools like in I.T courses.. stop wasting your sadness!
On 21 February 2011 17:48, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Some interns at my place of work, fresh from campus, didn't know how to install centos. They also didnt know that one can install virtualbox and install centos on top of it without touching the guest windows 7, made me rather sad coz I assumed these were basic skills.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Behind Google Chrome!<http://www.google.com/googlebooks/chrome/big_00.html>
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Regards,
Kamiru Mwangi,
0721792419 Skype: samuel.kamiru
Old school professors => bad curriculum. (by assignment) its equivalent to wine, wineskins, old and bad.... On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 9:49 AM, One Murithi <o0murithi@gmail.com> wrote:
My brief views on this:
- The curriculum could be leaner (see the UoN-SCI course bronchure, available at the reception)
- The end result of the programme is largely up to an individual -- At UoN-SCI, there was (I suppose this is still the case) sufficient literature (books) for any student with the intention of empowering self in useful CS skills. -- I actually found a course like Automata actually useful (Did some reading after classes)
- A missing element "might" have been lack of pulse with the "CS in practice". I suppose first years should be baptized with the fire of skunkworks or similar communities or the experiences of past students instead. (Maybe Phares can arrange to have meetups within campuses - there is more room)
--- Also, since universities are keen on keeping down costs, it is only practical that labs run on open source (or free) operating systems - UoN felt like another enterprise stuck with Windows.
On 2/24/11, Kamiru Mwangi Samuel <samuel.kamiru@gmail.com> wrote:
Andrew ...exactly my point....
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 10:34 PM, Andrew Wachira <washirah@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter - thats because they are not I.T graduates.. Computer Science is more of the fundamentals behind the tools and not necessarily usage of tools like in I.T courses.. stop wasting your sadness!
On 21 February 2011 17:48, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Some interns at my place of work, fresh from campus, didn't know how to install centos. They also didnt know that one can install virtualbox and install centos on top of it without touching the guest windows 7, made me rather sad coz I assumed these were basic skills.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Behind Google Chrome!<http://www.google.com/googlebooks/chrome/big_00.html>
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Regards,
Kamiru Mwangi,
0721792419 Skype: samuel.kamiru
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-- *“The twentieth century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: the growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy”* ~ Alex Carey ~ Tel No: 0x2af23696
And by the way, CHE is one step ahead. Last year they embarked on a harmonization process in the area of ICT which was successfully concluded. It went by the name CATS (CREDIT ACCUMULATION AND TRANSFER SYSTEM PROJECT) where the east African universities were invited to harmonize their curricula. On matters ICT, two programmes were analysed i.e. Computer science and IT. The minimum core knowledge was developed and bench marked with international standards. The purpose of this was to ensure that a graduate in computer science in any of the east African countries was globally accepted and could move their credits from one university to another without any difficulties as long as they do not transfer more that 49% of the total programme course credits. However, there was still enough room left for every university to express themselves in the output of their graduates. In this process, the different university programmes for the two programmes were brought to the table and analyzed with the aim of coming up with a harmonized document. This document was then presented to other stakeholders including industry players at a workshop held at KSMS. It was not an easy task but it was worth it. Therefore, every programme presented to CHE is compared with the output of that process. This ensures that any person from any university in EA having a degree in CS or IT has met the minimum international standards of a computer science or IT degree. The effect of that process may take some time as the EA slowly becomes one. Of interest is to note that different universities have different strengths in their programmes e.g. one university's was a little biased on the maths side while another was biased on engineering aspects (both coming from the fact that they may have either a strong maths background or a strong eng background)...nothing wrong with either as long as the minimum requirements are met. CHE will make its presence felt even more especially when the bill comes into effect. For now, it cannot flex its muscle concerning public universities. This is just to inform you that CHE is not sleeping on the job (I don't represent them). I know of the projects they have been running and therefore it should not be assumed that they are doing nothing. Thanks On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 9:58 AM, [Brainiac] <arebacollins@gmail.com> wrote:
Old school professors => bad curriculum. (by assignment)
its equivalent to wine, wineskins, old and bad....
On Thu, Feb 24, 2011 at 9:49 AM, One Murithi <o0murithi@gmail.com> wrote:
My brief views on this:
- The curriculum could be leaner (see the UoN-SCI course bronchure, available at the reception)
- The end result of the programme is largely up to an individual -- At UoN-SCI, there was (I suppose this is still the case) sufficient literature (books) for any student with the intention of empowering self in useful CS skills. -- I actually found a course like Automata actually useful (Did some reading after classes)
- A missing element "might" have been lack of pulse with the "CS in practice". I suppose first years should be baptized with the fire of skunkworks or similar communities or the experiences of past students instead. (Maybe Phares can arrange to have meetups within campuses - there is more room)
--- Also, since universities are keen on keeping down costs, it is only practical that labs run on open source (or free) operating systems - UoN felt like another enterprise stuck with Windows.
On 2/24/11, Kamiru Mwangi Samuel <samuel.kamiru@gmail.com> wrote:
Andrew ...exactly my point....
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 10:34 PM, Andrew Wachira <washirah@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter - thats because they are not I.T graduates.. Computer Science is more of the fundamentals behind the tools and not necessarily usage of tools like in I.T courses.. stop wasting your sadness!
On 21 February 2011 17:48, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Some interns at my place of work, fresh from campus, didn't know how to install centos. They also didnt know that one can install virtualbox and install centos on top of it without touching the guest windows 7, made me rather sad coz I assumed these were basic skills.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
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-- Behind Google Chrome!<http://www.google.com/googlebooks/chrome/big_00.html>
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-- Regards,
Kamiru Mwangi,
0721792419 Skype: samuel.kamiru
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-- *“The twentieth century has been characterized by three developments of great political importance: the growth of democracy, the growth of corporate power, and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy”*
~ Alex Carey ~
Tel No: 0x2af23696
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus<http://student.mit.edu/catalog/m6a.html>for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science. The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: *6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.* On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
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I so agree with Rad and to add on to it, the University trains you for the global job market! They teach concepts that enable you to analyze and think outside the box. We should stop this kind of thinking that Universities and other institutions of learning should only teach what is applicable in Kenya. I did Bsc. Computer Science and i don't remember even a single class in campus where i was taught how to write code, which is what they do in some commercial colleges in town (spoon feeding). They simply taught PROGRAMMING CONCEPTS, for example Object-Oriented Programming, they taught us about objects, methods etc and how they relate to real-world objects. It was up to the student to find out how to implement the concepts in a program and solve a real-life problem. Perhaps what should be enhanced in the curricula is the practical sessions. Institutions should set up well equipped computer laboratories and put a little more time on practical lab sessions to allow students to learn/apply/practice what they learn in theory. That is what in my evaluation is lacking in our Universities - too much time devoted to theory and sometimes lack of proper tools/machines. That's why most graduates go out there with lot's of theory in the head, and very little to show in terms of practical work. On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 2:30 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus<http://student.mit.edu/catalog/m6a.html>for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: *6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.*
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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Learning OOP or CS didnt have to be made this difficult! They simply taught PROGRAMMING CONCEPTS, for example Object-Oriented
Programming, they taught us about objects, methods etc and how they relate to real-world objects. It was up to the student to find out how to implement the concepts in a program and solve a real-life problem.
Point on Peter. Reading some comments here you get the impression that a CS student should have had an introduction to CS elsewhere before getting into the CS class. Cart before horse! On 22 February 2011 05:30, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus<http://student.mit.edu/catalog/m6a.html>for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: *6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.*
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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CS doesnt teach you the basics of Programming, which apparently universities in other Western countries do, and look at the products they produce. I have never heard of a CS student from Kenya doing something excellent. They are mostly managers who cant write a simple "Hello World" application. Hence I would only recommend Strathmore On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 2:13 PM, Ndungi Kyalo <ndungi@gmail.com> wrote:
Point on Peter.
Reading some comments here you get the impression that a CS student should have had an introduction to CS elsewhere before getting into the CS class. Cart before horse!
On 22 February 2011 05:30, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus<http://student.mit.edu/catalog/m6a.html>for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: *6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.*
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:17 PM, Paul Kevin <paultitude@gmail.com> wrote:
CS doesnt teach you the basics of Programming, which apparently universities in other Western countries do, and look at the products they produce. I have never heard of a CS student from Kenya doing something excellent. They are mostly managers who cant write a simple "Hello World" application. Hence I would only recommend Strathmore
I think you'd are deep in the rut with this one. CS is not about teaching programming. In fact programming is left as an exercise to the student. You are taught fundamentals, with a bit of C on how to implement data structures. This stuff is what you will later use to figure out: - Why MySQL is running so slow... You didn't use anindex. - From Datastructures Btrees - How BGP works - Graph theory - From linear algebra - How does shazam work - Hashes - From data structures etc So, In essence, I'd prefer to hire someone who understands these basics than a php guru who wouldn't know whether to pick an algorithm with O(3n) vs O(n^2)
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 2:13 PM, Ndungi Kyalo <ndungi@gmail.com> wrote:
Point on Peter.
Reading some comments here you get the impression that a CS student should have had an introduction to CS elsewhere before getting into the CS class. Cart before horse!
On 22 February 2011 05:30, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus<http://student.mit.edu/catalog/m6a.html>for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: *6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.*
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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Test Email On Tue, 2011-02-22 at 06:13 -0500, Ndungi Kyalo wrote:
Point on Peter.
Reading some comments here you get the impression that a CS student should have had an introduction to CS elsewhere before getting into the CS class. Cart before horse!
On 22 February 2011 05:30, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: 6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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I say teach the fundamentals,then provide fiber to the lab! I treasure the skills i got from my introduction to programming classes (Read in pascal)...Applicable everywhere. On another note,should we have 'Applied Computer Science' as a different course from just CS? On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus<http://student.mit.edu/catalog/m6a.html>for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: *6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.*
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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@Sheeroh, your lecturer may have forgotten to explain "why", but maybe you should have asked, ama? On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:21 AM, Mike M. <mmycool@gmail.com> wrote:
I say teach the fundamentals,then provide fiber to the lab! I treasure the skills i got from my introduction to programming classes (Read in pascal)...Applicable everywhere.
On another note,should we have 'Applied Computer Science' as a different course from just CS?
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus<http://student.mit.edu/catalog/m6a.html>for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: *6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.*
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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The problem is that some lecturers aren't in touch with the current trends. For example, I remember learning automata and theory. Had no clue why we were drawing letters in circles arrow-pointing to other letters in circles. Little did I know that this was regular expressions. If the lecturer gave us pointers to PERL, the abstract stuff would have been much more palatable. So, if you are a lecturer or want to be one, please provide context. On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:25 PM, julianne anyim <julianneanyim@gmail.com>wrote:
@Sheeroh, your lecturer may have forgotten to explain "why", but maybe you should have asked, ama?
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:21 AM, Mike M. <mmycool@gmail.com> wrote:
I say teach the fundamentals,then provide fiber to the lab! I treasure the skills i got from my introduction to programming classes (Read in pascal)...Applicable everywhere.
On another note,should we have 'Applied Computer Science' as a different course from just CS?
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com>wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus<http://student.mit.edu/catalog/m6a.html>for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: *6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.*
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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@Laban I also survived automata. And our notes were similar to what was in some text book - word for word. I should print a t-shirt with that message "I survived automata" On 22 February 2011 14:29, Laban Mwangi <lmwangi@gmail.com> wrote:
The problem is that some lecturers aren't in touch with the current trends. For example, I remember learning automata and theory. Had no clue why we were drawing letters in circles arrow-pointing to other letters in circles. Little did I know that this was regular expressions. If the lecturer gave us pointers to PERL, the abstract stuff would have been much more palatable. So, if you are a lecturer or want to be one, please provide context.
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:25 PM, julianne anyim <julianneanyim@gmail.com>wrote:
@Sheeroh, your lecturer may have forgotten to explain "why", but maybe you should have asked, ama?
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:21 AM, Mike M. <mmycool@gmail.com> wrote:
I say teach the fundamentals,then provide fiber to the lab! I treasure the skills i got from my introduction to programming classes (Read in pascal)...Applicable everywhere.
On another note,should we have 'Applied Computer Science' as a different course from just CS?
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com>wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus<http://student.mit.edu/catalog/m6a.html>for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: *6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.*
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com
wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
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LOL! On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:33 AM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
@Laban I also survived automata. And our notes were similar to what was in some text book - word for word. I should print a t-shirt with that message "I survived automata"
On 22 February 2011 14:29, Laban Mwangi <lmwangi@gmail.com> wrote:
The problem is that some lecturers aren't in touch with the current trends. For example, I remember learning automata and theory. Had no clue why we were drawing letters in circles arrow-pointing to other letters in circles. Little did I know that this was regular expressions. If the lecturer gave us pointers to PERL, the abstract stuff would have been much more palatable. So, if you are a lecturer or want to be one, please provide context.
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:25 PM, julianne anyim <julianneanyim@gmail.com>wrote:
@Sheeroh, your lecturer may have forgotten to explain "why", but maybe you should have asked, ama?
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:21 AM, Mike M. <mmycool@gmail.com> wrote:
I say teach the fundamentals,then provide fiber to the lab! I treasure the skills i got from my introduction to programming classes (Read in pascal)...Applicable everywhere.
On another note,should we have 'Applied Computer Science' as a different course from just CS?
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com>wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus<http://student.mit.edu/catalog/m6a.html>for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: *6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.*
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia < simon.mbuthia@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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@Laban,for the automata... theory of computing...the turing machine...was tired of writing notes...copied two sentences on google,word by word...never wrote again! I survived anyway! On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 2:29 PM, Laban Mwangi <lmwangi@gmail.com> wrote:
The problem is that some lecturers aren't in touch with the current trends. For example, I remember learning automata and theory. Had no clue why we were drawing letters in circles arrow-pointing to other letters in circles. Little did I know that this was regular expressions. If the lecturer gave us pointers to PERL, the abstract stuff would have been much more palatable. So, if you are a lecturer or want to be one, please provide context.
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:25 PM, julianne anyim <julianneanyim@gmail.com>wrote:
@Sheeroh, your lecturer may have forgotten to explain "why", but maybe you should have asked, ama?
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:21 AM, Mike M. <mmycool@gmail.com> wrote:
I say teach the fundamentals,then provide fiber to the lab! I treasure the skills i got from my introduction to programming classes (Read in pascal)...Applicable everywhere.
On another note,should we have 'Applied Computer Science' as a different course from just CS?
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com>wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus<http://student.mit.edu/catalog/m6a.html>for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: *6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.*
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com
wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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Perhaps it would help if the programming language was used as a tool to explain fundamental concepts. Take a look at http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/electrical-engineering-and-computer-science/6-00-... On 22 February 2011 15:18, Mike M. <mmycool@gmail.com> wrote:
@Laban,for the automata... theory of computing...the turing machine...was tired of writing notes...copied two sentences on google,word by word...never wrote again! I survived anyway!
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 2:29 PM, Laban Mwangi <lmwangi@gmail.com> wrote:
The problem is that some lecturers aren't in touch with the current trends. For example, I remember learning automata and theory. Had no clue why we were drawing letters in circles arrow-pointing to other letters in circles. Little did I know that this was regular expressions. If the lecturer gave us pointers to PERL, the abstract stuff would have been much more palatable. So, if you are a lecturer or want to be one, please provide context.
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:25 PM, julianne anyim <julianneanyim@gmail.com> wrote:
@Sheeroh, your lecturer may have forgotten to explain "why", but maybe you should have asked, ama?
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 3:21 AM, Mike M. <mmycool@gmail.com> wrote:
I say teach the fundamentals,then provide fiber to the lab! I treasure the skills i got from my introduction to programming classes (Read in pascal)...Applicable everywhere.
On another note,should we have 'Applied Computer Science' as a different course from just CS?
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 1:30 PM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Simon, have a look at MIT's syllabus for Electrical Engineering and Computer Science.
The paragraph below I found particularly interesting, the highlighting is mine: 6.00 Introduction to Computer Science and Programming Introduction to computer science and programming for students with little or no programming experience. Students learn how to program and how to use computational techniques to solve problems. Topics include algorithms, simulation techniques, and use of software libraries. Assignments are done using the Python programming language.
On Mon, Feb 21, 2011 at 7:16 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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-- Kind regards Jason Mule
I guess the problem with the Computer Science programs in Kenya is lack of a complete picture. This is probably because the program is mainly an offshoot of math programs. A basic project like putting together a dummy router, would complete the picture as to why you need the math, why you need assembler, basically, completing the picture. But currently, most projects in Kenya while in University are the terribly tired and recycled "Library Management System" and it's close sister "Video Library Management System" which offer a silo of the practical experience required. Think about it, for someone to build a device like the iPhone, they need to understand all the bits of computing we are saying are "irrelevant". From networking, to compiler theory, embedded computing, assembler etc etc. At the end of the day if you were to work for say Apple, in product development, you would need to understand how all of them relate. No field of computing operates as a total silo.... The best that people can do is give a good framework, and relate everything. You can't go down to the detail... -- With Regards, Phares Kariuki | T: +254 734 810 802 | E: pkariuki@gmail.com | Twitter: kaboro | Skype: kariukiphares | B: http://www.kaboro.com/ |
Better software development skills On Feb 21, 2011 4:16 PM, "Simon Mbuthia" <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
I cant resist contributing to this. First and foremost i commend Simon Mbuthia for doing a noble thing and his university as well that wants to link its courses to reality, market research, so most of you should contribute in terms of where you see your computer science studies having prepared you or messed you up. I havent practised anything technical in comp science but still find myself more updated than your regular graduate because i read latest publications , trends and concepts. Recently I was looking for an ICT strategist and couldnt evaluate a single person from this whole network and realised they lack significantly from the market, hence its difficult to get people who can translate business concepts to technological requirements regardless of the specific vendor the technology is coming from. My contribution is that the more fundamental problem for me was the exposure of lecturers and how delinked they were from the marketplace reality. A friend told me how its not in the job description of Lecturers to do research and publish....which is unbelievable!!! I would have been interested in doing a course that would link all my comp science stuff to creating solutions for a mobile,geographically dispersed and majorly poor africa regardless of whether its programming or networking or algorithms. University should teach us to think of where to find solutions or create concepts, not teach us the final answer because reality and technology changes but fundamental things in life do not. Also if universities could have market experts who are day to day practitioners invited to give talks within classes, and more real life AFRICAN case studies that would be super! Over and out On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Theus Owuor <kootie73@gmail.com> wrote:
Better software development skills
On Feb 21, 2011 4:16 PM, "Simon Mbuthia" <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
For those computer science graduates who want to be taught how to think, start by reviewing the Turing thesis and P vs NP problem. if you can add something to the two, you will contribute greatly to the computer science field ................................................................. my two cents. The most important aspect of the computer science programme that has helped me is the theoretical concept that we were taught Due to the detailed and very comprehensive theory that we were taught, i dont have to worry about a new programming language, Operating systems, mobile tools, frameworks e.t.c All i need is to remember the principals of a programming language, look of the manual of the new language and then i am done. In two weeks i am confortable with the new technology The problem is the students who should not have done computer science end up doing it because it is marketable. Universities can never and will never train graduates for specific products. Instead, universities give theoretical and conceptual aspects that enables students fit in specific job requirements Imagine the following 1. If universities taught about electricity (so that students can work in KPLC), how would Farady have invented the current? We would not be having electricity 2. If Engineers are taught about cars, where would cars have come from? Remeber the cars on the road today owe their existense to the three newton laws of motion What needs to be done for computer science programmes is to come up with ways and means to ensure the students conceptualize and understand the relation between the products that come out of computer science theoretical aspects. In fact the following key areas should be emphasized 1.Automata theory and complexity 2. Computational Complexity 3. Computability complexity 3. Analysis of algorithms (How many developers/Programmers do this?) 4. Number theoretic 5. Principles of Programming Languages 6. Compilers and Interpreters ...... ________________________________ From: Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com> To: Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Sent: Tue, February 22, 2011 4:39:56 PM Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Computer Science Curriculum Development I cant resist contributing to this. First and foremost i commend Simon Mbuthia for doing a noble thing and his university as well that wants to link its courses to reality, market research, so most of you should contribute in terms of where you see your computer science studies having prepared you or messed you up. I havent practised anything technical in comp science but still find myself more updated than your regular graduate because i read latest publications , trends and concepts. Recently I was looking for an ICT strategist and couldnt evaluate a single person from this whole network and realised they lack significantly from the market, hence its difficult to get people who can translate business concepts to technological requirements regardless of the specific vendor the technology is coming from. My contribution is that the more fundamental problem for me was the exposure of lecturers and how delinked they were from the marketplace reality. A friend told me how its not in the job description of Lecturers to do research and publish....which is unbelievable!!! I would have been interested in doing a course that would link all my comp science stuff to creating solutions for a mobile,geographically dispersed and majorly poor africa regardless of whether its programming or networking or algorithms. University should teach us to think of where to find solutions or create concepts, not teach us the final answer because reality and technology changes but fundamental things in life do not. Also if universities could have market experts who are day to day practitioners invited to give talks within classes, and more real life AFRICAN case studies that would be super! Over and out On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Theus Owuor <kootie73@gmail.com> wrote: Better software development skills
On Feb 21, 2011 4:16 PM, "Simon Mbuthia" <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
Computer science student need to do a lot of Math! On 22 February 2011 17:50, Shadrack Mwaniki <shadrack_mwaniki@yahoo.com>wrote:
For those computer science graduates who want to be taught how to think, start by reviewing the Turing thesis and P vs NP problem. if you can add something to the two, you will contribute greatly to the computer science field ................................................................. my two cents.
The most important aspect of the computer science programme that has helped me is the theoretical concept that we were taught Due to the detailed and very comprehensive theory that we were taught, i dont have to worry about a new programming language, Operating systems, mobile tools, frameworks e.t.c All i need is to remember the principals of a programming language, look of the manual of the new language and then i am done. In two weeks i am confortable with the new technology The problem is the students who should not have done computer science end up doing it because it is marketable. Universities can never and will never train graduates for specific products. Instead, universities give theoretical and conceptual aspects that enables students fit in specific job requirements
Imagine the following 1. If universities taught about electricity (so that students can work in KPLC), how would Farady have invented the current? We would not be having electricity 2. If Engineers are taught about cars, where would cars have come from? Remeber the cars on the road today owe their existense to the three newton laws of motion
What needs to be done for computer science programmes is to come up with ways and means to ensure the students conceptualize and understand the relation between the products that come out of computer science theoretical aspects.
In fact the following key areas should be emphasized 1.Automata theory and complexity 2. Computational Complexity 3. Computability complexity 3. Analysis of algorithms (How many developers/Programmers do this?) 4. Number theoretic 5. Principles of Programming Languages 6. Compilers and Interpreters
......
------------------------------ *From:* Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com>
*To:* Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> *Sent:* Tue, February 22, 2011 4:39:56 PM
*Subject:* Re: [Skunkworks] Computer Science Curriculum Development
I cant resist contributing to this.
First and foremost i commend Simon Mbuthia for doing a noble thing and his university as well that wants to link its courses to reality, market research, so most of you should contribute in terms of where you see your computer science studies having prepared you or messed you up.
I havent practised anything technical in comp science but still find myself more updated than your regular graduate because i read latest publications , trends and concepts. Recently I was looking for an ICT strategist and couldnt evaluate a single person from this whole network and realised they lack significantly from the market, hence its difficult to get people who can translate business concepts to technological requirements regardless of the specific vendor the technology is coming from.
My contribution is that the more fundamental problem for me was the exposure of lecturers and how delinked they were from the marketplace reality. A friend told me how its not in the job description of Lecturers to do research and publish....which is unbelievable!!!
I would have been interested in doing a course that would link all my comp science stuff to creating solutions for a mobile,geographically dispersed and majorly poor africa regardless of whether its programming or networking or algorithms.
University should teach us to think of where to find solutions or create concepts, not teach us the final answer because reality and technology changes but fundamental things in life do not. Also if universities could have market experts who are day to day practitioners invited to give talks within classes, and more real life AFRICAN case studies that would be super!
Over and out
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Theus Owuor <kootie73@gmail.com> wrote:
Better software development skills
On Feb 21, 2011 4:16 PM, "Simon Mbuthia" <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Mimano G. Muthondu, Software Developer skype : gmimano Mobile : +254 723 615 206
Hi, First of I am grateful for this chance to "Fungua roho". I think after 2 years from campus I have changed on my views on what I thought. One things change very fast. In that period I have found myself developing applications for a hospital, a construction company and businesses. In both cases I have been forced to very fast learn what those are all about. 2 years ago I thought ODE was useless but know I know better. Real computer science to me is providing solutions to the many challenges in the society. My suggestion wouldn't be more to a change in curriculum but the universities or colleges creating an environment for students to learn on their own and benefit the community. I look forward to a time where computer science students be charged with responsibilities of providing IT Solutions for schools, hospitals and any other institution that may need a service. A project to me won't be working on think which you don't have an idea if it can work, but you are just doing to pass. I would suggest that we should work on IT Solutions in a very basic but in a way that will benefit the community. I have discovered that we spend much time thinking about things that in no way affects our day to day living. We know so much but very little is put to use. * Regards Richard Gathogo. +254752847158** +4521843194 ** Java Developer*,* * * Skype: muraguri2005* On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 5:55 PM, Geoffrey Mimano <soyfactor@gmail.com>wrote:
Computer science student need to do a lot of Math!
On 22 February 2011 17:50, Shadrack Mwaniki <shadrack_mwaniki@yahoo.com>wrote:
For those computer science graduates who want to be taught how to think, start by reviewing the Turing thesis and P vs NP problem. if you can add something to the two, you will contribute greatly to the computer science field ................................................................. my two cents.
The most important aspect of the computer science programme that has helped me is the theoretical concept that we were taught Due to the detailed and very comprehensive theory that we were taught, i dont have to worry about a new programming language, Operating systems, mobile tools, frameworks e.t.c All i need is to remember the principals of a programming language, look of the manual of the new language and then i am done. In two weeks i am confortable with the new technology The problem is the students who should not have done computer science end up doing it because it is marketable. Universities can never and will never train graduates for specific products. Instead, universities give theoretical and conceptual aspects that enables students fit in specific job requirements
Imagine the following 1. If universities taught about electricity (so that students can work in KPLC), how would Farady have invented the current? We would not be having electricity 2. If Engineers are taught about cars, where would cars have come from? Remeber the cars on the road today owe their existense to the three newton laws of motion
What needs to be done for computer science programmes is to come up with ways and means to ensure the students conceptualize and understand the relation between the products that come out of computer science theoretical aspects.
In fact the following key areas should be emphasized 1.Automata theory and complexity 2. Computational Complexity 3. Computability complexity 3. Analysis of algorithms (How many developers/Programmers do this?) 4. Number theoretic 5. Principles of Programming Languages 6. Compilers and Interpreters
......
------------------------------ *From:* Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com>
*To:* Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> *Sent:* Tue, February 22, 2011 4:39:56 PM
*Subject:* Re: [Skunkworks] Computer Science Curriculum Development
I cant resist contributing to this.
First and foremost i commend Simon Mbuthia for doing a noble thing and his university as well that wants to link its courses to reality, market research, so most of you should contribute in terms of where you see your computer science studies having prepared you or messed you up.
I havent practised anything technical in comp science but still find myself more updated than your regular graduate because i read latest publications , trends and concepts. Recently I was looking for an ICT strategist and couldnt evaluate a single person from this whole network and realised they lack significantly from the market, hence its difficult to get people who can translate business concepts to technological requirements regardless of the specific vendor the technology is coming from.
My contribution is that the more fundamental problem for me was the exposure of lecturers and how delinked they were from the marketplace reality. A friend told me how its not in the job description of Lecturers to do research and publish....which is unbelievable!!!
I would have been interested in doing a course that would link all my comp science stuff to creating solutions for a mobile,geographically dispersed and majorly poor africa regardless of whether its programming or networking or algorithms.
University should teach us to think of where to find solutions or create concepts, not teach us the final answer because reality and technology changes but fundamental things in life do not. Also if universities could have market experts who are day to day practitioners invited to give talks within classes, and more real life AFRICAN case studies that would be super!
Over and out
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Theus Owuor <kootie73@gmail.com> wrote:
Better software development skills
On Feb 21, 2011 4:16 PM, "Simon Mbuthia" <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Mimano G. Muthondu, Software Developer skype : gmimano Mobile : +254 723 615 206
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 10:15 PM, Richard Gathogo <muraguri2005@gmail.com>wrote:
Hi, First of I am grateful for this chance to "Fungua roho". I think after 2 years from campus I have changed on my views on what I thought. One things change very fast. In that period I have found myself developing applications for a hospital, a construction company and businesses. In both cases I have been forced to very fast learn what those are all about. 2 years ago I thought ODE was useless but know I know better. Real computer science to me is providing solutions to the many challenges in the society.
My suggestion wouldn't be more to a change in curriculum but the universities or colleges creating an environment for students to learn on their own and benefit the community. I look forward to a time where computer science students be charged with responsibilities of providing IT Solutions for schools, hospitals and any other institution that may need a service.
What do you mean by IT solutions?
A project to me won't be working on think which you don't have an idea if it can work, but you are just doing to pass. I would suggest that we should work on IT Solutions in a very basic but in a way that will benefit the community. I have discovered that we spend much time thinking about things that in no way affects our day to day living. We know so much but very little is put to use.
Because we choose not to put our skills to task. If you are lecturer, what would you rank higher? - A fourth year student with a hospital management project (Which has been done to death) - basic php/VB - A student who developed a mobile app that lists real estate rentals and finds similar rentals using AI (K nearest neighbour) - A student who decide to analyse the traffic photos from http://home.co.ke/index.php/traffic-cameras and using image recognition give statement such as roundabout x is at 80% utilisation. Service time is 2 minutes - A student who analysed this- https://github.com/orta/dna/blob/master/README.markdown and came up with a predictive engine given a new sequence? Progress comes from research. If we motivate our students to forge into new problem areas, we are apt to profit more. Intellectually and financially. Have a look at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Research_and_development http://www.nationmaster.com/correlations/eco_gov_spe_in_res_and_dev-economy-... The correlation is obvious: http://www.nationmaster.com/plot/eco_gov_spe_in_res_and_dev/cri_dea_pen_abo_... http://www.nationmaster.com/plot/eco_gov_spe_in_res_and_dev/eco_pat_gra/flag Still don't believe research powers economies?
* Regards Richard Gathogo. +254752847158** +4521843194 ** Java Developer*,* * * Skype: muraguri2005*
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 5:55 PM, Geoffrey Mimano <soyfactor@gmail.com>wrote:
Computer science student need to do a lot of Math!
On 22 February 2011 17:50, Shadrack Mwaniki <shadrack_mwaniki@yahoo.com>wrote:
For those computer science graduates who want to be taught how to think, start by reviewing the Turing thesis and P vs NP problem. if you can add something to the two, you will contribute greatly to the computer science field ................................................................. my two cents.
The most important aspect of the computer science programme that has helped me is the theoretical concept that we were taught Due to the detailed and very comprehensive theory that we were taught, i dont have to worry about a new programming language, Operating systems, mobile tools, frameworks e.t.c All i need is to remember the principals of a programming language, look of the manual of the new language and then i am done. In two weeks i am confortable with the new technology The problem is the students who should not have done computer science end up doing it because it is marketable. Universities can never and will never train graduates for specific products. Instead, universities give theoretical and conceptual aspects that enables students fit in specific job requirements
Imagine the following 1. If universities taught about electricity (so that students can work in KPLC), how would Farady have invented the current? We would not be having electricity 2. If Engineers are taught about cars, where would cars have come from? Remeber the cars on the road today owe their existense to the three newton laws of motion
What needs to be done for computer science programmes is to come up with ways and means to ensure the students conceptualize and understand the relation between the products that come out of computer science theoretical aspects.
In fact the following key areas should be emphasized 1.Automata theory and complexity 2. Computational Complexity 3. Computability complexity 3. Analysis of algorithms (How many developers/Programmers do this?) 4. Number theoretic 5. Principles of Programming Languages 6. Compilers and Interpreters
......
------------------------------ *From:* Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com>
*To:* Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> *Sent:* Tue, February 22, 2011 4:39:56 PM
*Subject:* Re: [Skunkworks] Computer Science Curriculum Development
I cant resist contributing to this.
First and foremost i commend Simon Mbuthia for doing a noble thing and his university as well that wants to link its courses to reality, market research, so most of you should contribute in terms of where you see your computer science studies having prepared you or messed you up.
I havent practised anything technical in comp science but still find myself more updated than your regular graduate because i read latest publications , trends and concepts. Recently I was looking for an ICT strategist and couldnt evaluate a single person from this whole network and realised they lack significantly from the market, hence its difficult to get people who can translate business concepts to technological requirements regardless of the specific vendor the technology is coming from.
My contribution is that the more fundamental problem for me was the exposure of lecturers and how delinked they were from the marketplace reality. A friend told me how its not in the job description of Lecturers to do research and publish....which is unbelievable!!!
I would have been interested in doing a course that would link all my comp science stuff to creating solutions for a mobile,geographically dispersed and majorly poor africa regardless of whether its programming or networking or algorithms.
University should teach us to think of where to find solutions or create concepts, not teach us the final answer because reality and technology changes but fundamental things in life do not. Also if universities could have market experts who are day to day practitioners invited to give talks within classes, and more real life AFRICAN case studies that would be super!
Over and out
On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Theus Owuor <kootie73@gmail.com> wrote:
Better software development skills
On Feb 21, 2011 4:16 PM, "Simon Mbuthia" <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Mimano G. Muthondu, Software Developer skype : gmimano Mobile : +254 723 615 206
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
RAD!! thank you for putting this accross, I hope people will start to understand that which they so easily speak against. I could not agree more here. People do not understand the objectives of an academic degree as opposed to a certification. I often find people comparing the two and throwing mud at one based on merits of the other. My question would be simple - Who is Charles Babbage and who trained him about the concept of the computers today? - who is john von neumann and how much did he contribute to computing? how? can he be considered a computer scientist of an IT guru? mind you he was a mathematician by profession. - very soon we will see computers made of memristors, do you know that that concept was developed by an academician a long time ago? The problem is that many people do not really get the objective of a computer science degree. The evidence of this is one who expects to be * taught* a certain programming language instead of the underlying programming paradigm. We have over 400 programming languages!!!! who's gonna teach you that?? But a good computer science graduate who DID NOT LIVE ON THE LECTURER'S NOTES ALONE can seamlessly transfer from one programming language to another in a matter of weeks! if he so wish. Just give him/her a book! But ideally, he/she should be exploring new ways of solving computer problems and leave the implementation to IT graduates. Ideally, he should not be too engrossed in Adroid features but its underlying theoretical applications. Who develops all these programming paradigms? Who is expected to innovate (come up with new paradigms) if not the computer science graduate? Please, put the blame where it belongs and in my opinion it belongs squarely on us students. Just observe and see how many students really read books. Or simply visit the university libraries and they will tell you for sure that the peak times are during or right before the exams. Ideally, programming languages *concepts *are taught and the most prominent are highlighted individually eg 1. introduction to programming might cover unstructured leading to structured programming (universities choose a programming language *of their choice* to introduce such concepts). The learning outcome here is a graduate who can seamlessly code in any structured programming languages like C, pascal, COBOL, basic etc but more importantly understands the reasoning underlying such methods of solving computer related problems 2. OOP and modular programming paradigms should also be taught touching the underlying concepts and hence highlighting the shift from C to C#, C++, Java etc event driven programming as a small concept based introduction 3. functional programming concepts 4. compiler construction etc What is the expected result? Well, some of our own Linus trovalds! or even our very own bill gates!! That is a computer scientist for you. not a graduate who depends on other programming languages to code applications, an IT graduate should do that. So please, understand the objectives of the course before bashing it and loading it with baggage it should not carry. Of importance is also to distinguish between the objectives of IT degree and computer science degree. The products of these two degrees are meant to be different. So, if you wish to be and end user support and familiar with the latest technologies so that you can apply them then you might be better off taking an IT course and offcourse supplement it with certifications for every new technology. Computer science is for scientists. You might develop a concept paper like Charles Babbage and john von neumann and let the engineers implement it and that is computer science for you, mind you many of these innovators were mathematicians. Before you develop a course, please read widely on the objectives and compare with international standards like ACM and IEEE Computer Society. They have developed the minimum areas of knowledge that may be of help. This forum may just give you insights that at personal and completely unprofessional that are influenced by non-academic reasoning derived from such technical courses like CCNA and CISA that are tailor made for products of a certain company and hence do not equip you to innovate. Such courses have their place and academic courses have their place, it is important to consider their objectives carefully before you mix the two.
I must say am so encouraged after reading this :) On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 12:34 AM, kennedy waweru <kenne2ke@gmail.com> wrote:
RAD!! thank you for putting this accross, I hope people will start to understand that which they so easily speak against.
I could not agree more here. People do not understand the objectives of an academic degree as opposed to a certification. I often find people comparing the two and throwing mud at one based on merits of the other.
My question would be simple
- Who is Charles Babbage and who trained him about the concept of the computers today? - who is john von neumann and how much did he contribute to computing? how? can he be considered a computer scientist of an IT guru? mind you he was a mathematician by profession. - very soon we will see computers made of memristors, do you know that that concept was developed by an academician a long time ago?
The problem is that many people do not really get the objective of a computer science degree. The evidence of this is one who expects to be * taught* a certain programming language instead of the underlying programming paradigm. We have over 400 programming languages!!!! who's gonna teach you that??
But a good computer science graduate who DID NOT LIVE ON THE LECTURER'S NOTES ALONE can seamlessly transfer from one programming language to another in a matter of weeks! if he so wish. Just give him/her a book! But ideally, he/she should be exploring new ways of solving computer problems and leave the implementation to IT graduates. Ideally, he should not be too engrossed in Adroid features but its underlying theoretical applications.
Who develops all these programming paradigms? Who is expected to innovate (come up with new paradigms) if not the computer science graduate? Please, put the blame where it belongs and in my opinion it belongs squarely on us students. Just observe and see how many students really read books. Or simply visit the university libraries and they will tell you for sure that the peak times are during or right before the exams. Ideally, programming languages *concepts *are taught and the most prominent are highlighted individually eg
1. introduction to programming might cover unstructured leading to structured programming (universities choose a programming language *of their choice* to introduce such concepts). The learning outcome here is a graduate who can seamlessly code in any structured programming languages like C, pascal, COBOL, basic etc but more importantly understands the reasoning underlying such methods of solving computer related problems 2. OOP and modular programming paradigms should also be taught touching the underlying concepts and hence highlighting the shift from C to C#, C++, Java etc event driven programming as a small concept based introduction 3. functional programming concepts 4. compiler construction etc
What is the expected result? Well, some of our own Linus trovalds! or even our very own bill gates!! That is a computer scientist for you. not a graduate who depends on other programming languages to code applications, an IT graduate should do that.
So please, understand the objectives of the course before bashing it and loading it with baggage it should not carry.
Of importance is also to distinguish between the objectives of IT degree and computer science degree. The products of these two degrees are meant to be different. So, if you wish to be and end user support and familiar with the latest technologies so that you can apply them then you might be better off taking an IT course and offcourse supplement it with certifications for every new technology.
Computer science is for scientists. You might develop a concept paper like Charles Babbage and john von neumann and let the engineers implement it and that is computer science for you, mind you many of these innovators were mathematicians.
Before you develop a course, please read widely on the objectives and compare with international standards like ACM and IEEE Computer Society. They have developed the minimum areas of knowledge that may be of help. This forum may just give you insights that at personal and completely unprofessional that are influenced by non-academic reasoning derived from such technical courses like CCNA and CISA that are tailor made for products of a certain company and hence do not equip you to innovate. Such courses have their place and academic courses have their place, it is important to consider their objectives carefully before you mix the two.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Hi guys, Impressive ideas being shared here. Going back to my very first message, I sought to know "*from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program**.*" Not to imply that what has been discussed so far is irrelevant, but rather to get some kind of aggregation of what's been shared such that it fits into the italicized and emboldened sentence above :) I really appreciate your input. Me. On 23 February 2011 12:03, julianne anyim <julianneanyim@gmail.com> wrote:
I must say am so encouraged after reading this :)
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 12:34 AM, kennedy waweru <kenne2ke@gmail.com>wrote:
RAD!! thank you for putting this accross, I hope people will start to understand that which they so easily speak against.
I could not agree more here. People do not understand the objectives of an academic degree as opposed to a certification. I often find people comparing the two and throwing mud at one based on merits of the other.
My question would be simple
- Who is Charles Babbage and who trained him about the concept of the computers today? - who is john von neumann and how much did he contribute to computing? how? can he be considered a computer scientist of an IT guru? mind you he was a mathematician by profession. - very soon we will see computers made of memristors, do you know that that concept was developed by an academician a long time ago?
The problem is that many people do not really get the objective of a computer science degree. The evidence of this is one who expects to be * taught* a certain programming language instead of the underlying programming paradigm. We have over 400 programming languages!!!! who's gonna teach you that??
But a good computer science graduate who DID NOT LIVE ON THE LECTURER'S NOTES ALONE can seamlessly transfer from one programming language to another in a matter of weeks! if he so wish. Just give him/her a book! But ideally, he/she should be exploring new ways of solving computer problems and leave the implementation to IT graduates. Ideally, he should not be too engrossed in Adroid features but its underlying theoretical applications.
Who develops all these programming paradigms? Who is expected to innovate (come up with new paradigms) if not the computer science graduate? Please, put the blame where it belongs and in my opinion it belongs squarely on us students. Just observe and see how many students really read books. Or simply visit the university libraries and they will tell you for sure that the peak times are during or right before the exams. Ideally, programming languages *concepts *are taught and the most prominent are highlighted individually eg
1. introduction to programming might cover unstructured leading to structured programming (universities choose a programming language *of their choice* to introduce such concepts). The learning outcome here is a graduate who can seamlessly code in any structured programming languages like C, pascal, COBOL, basic etc but more importantly understands the reasoning underlying such methods of solving computer related problems 2. OOP and modular programming paradigms should also be taught touching the underlying concepts and hence highlighting the shift from C to C#, C++, Java etc event driven programming as a small concept based introduction 3. functional programming concepts 4. compiler construction etc
What is the expected result? Well, some of our own Linus trovalds! or even our very own bill gates!! That is a computer scientist for you. not a graduate who depends on other programming languages to code applications, an IT graduate should do that.
So please, understand the objectives of the course before bashing it and loading it with baggage it should not carry.
Of importance is also to distinguish between the objectives of IT degree and computer science degree. The products of these two degrees are meant to be different. So, if you wish to be and end user support and familiar with the latest technologies so that you can apply them then you might be better off taking an IT course and offcourse supplement it with certifications for every new technology.
Computer science is for scientists. You might develop a concept paper like Charles Babbage and john von neumann and let the engineers implement it and that is computer science for you, mind you many of these innovators were mathematicians.
Before you develop a course, please read widely on the objectives and compare with international standards like ACM and IEEE Computer Society. They have developed the minimum areas of knowledge that may be of help. This forum may just give you insights that at personal and completely unprofessional that are influenced by non-academic reasoning derived from such technical courses like CCNA and CISA that are tailor made for products of a certain company and hence do not equip you to innovate. Such courses have their place and academic courses have their place, it is important to consider their objectives carefully before you mix the two.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Hi, If anyone can, please find a way to get this thread AS-IS to lecturers n concerned parties like CHE. It realy would help. Is it possible to 'export' this thread 'as-is'? I've tried to forward but can't seem to get the whole thread. Anyone who can, please spread it. I had a few of my old CS lecturers to show it to. Let's take action. On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 1:54 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hi guys,
Impressive ideas being shared here. Going back to my very first message, I sought to know "*from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program**.*" Not to imply that what has been discussed so far is irrelevant, but rather to get some kind of aggregation of what's been shared such that it fits into the italicized and emboldened sentence above :)
I really appreciate your input.
Me.
On 23 February 2011 12:03, julianne anyim <julianneanyim@gmail.com> wrote:
I must say am so encouraged after reading this :)
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 12:34 AM, kennedy waweru <kenne2ke@gmail.com>wrote:
RAD!! thank you for putting this accross, I hope people will start to understand that which they so easily speak against.
I could not agree more here. People do not understand the objectives of an academic degree as opposed to a certification. I often find people comparing the two and throwing mud at one based on merits of the other.
My question would be simple
- Who is Charles Babbage and who trained him about the concept of the computers today? - who is john von neumann and how much did he contribute to computing? how? can he be considered a computer scientist of an IT guru? mind you he was a mathematician by profession. - very soon we will see computers made of memristors, do you know that that concept was developed by an academician a long time ago?
The problem is that many people do not really get the objective of a computer science degree. The evidence of this is one who expects to be * taught* a certain programming language instead of the underlying programming paradigm. We have over 400 programming languages!!!! who's gonna teach you that??
But a good computer science graduate who DID NOT LIVE ON THE LECTURER'S NOTES ALONE can seamlessly transfer from one programming language to another in a matter of weeks! if he so wish. Just give him/her a book! But ideally, he/she should be exploring new ways of solving computer problems and leave the implementation to IT graduates. Ideally, he should not be too engrossed in Adroid features but its underlying theoretical applications.
Who develops all these programming paradigms? Who is expected to innovate (come up with new paradigms) if not the computer science graduate? Please, put the blame where it belongs and in my opinion it belongs squarely on us students. Just observe and see how many students really read books. Or simply visit the university libraries and they will tell you for sure that the peak times are during or right before the exams. Ideally, programming languages *concepts *are taught and the most prominent are highlighted individually eg
1. introduction to programming might cover unstructured leading to structured programming (universities choose a programming language *of their choice* to introduce such concepts). The learning outcome here is a graduate who can seamlessly code in any structured programming languages like C, pascal, COBOL, basic etc but more importantly understands the reasoning underlying such methods of solving computer related problems 2. OOP and modular programming paradigms should also be taught touching the underlying concepts and hence highlighting the shift from C to C#, C++, Java etc event driven programming as a small concept based introduction 3. functional programming concepts 4. compiler construction etc
What is the expected result? Well, some of our own Linus trovalds! or even our very own bill gates!! That is a computer scientist for you. not a graduate who depends on other programming languages to code applications, an IT graduate should do that.
So please, understand the objectives of the course before bashing it and loading it with baggage it should not carry.
Of importance is also to distinguish between the objectives of IT degree and computer science degree. The products of these two degrees are meant to be different. So, if you wish to be and end user support and familiar with the latest technologies so that you can apply them then you might be better off taking an IT course and offcourse supplement it with certifications for every new technology.
Computer science is for scientists. You might develop a concept paper like Charles Babbage and john von neumann and let the engineers implement it and that is computer science for you, mind you many of these innovators were mathematicians.
Before you develop a course, please read widely on the objectives and compare with international standards like ACM and IEEE Computer Society. They have developed the minimum areas of knowledge that may be of help. This forum may just give you insights that at personal and completely unprofessional that are influenced by non-academic reasoning derived from such technical courses like CCNA and CISA that are tailor made for products of a certain company and hence do not equip you to innovate. Such courses have their place and academic courses have their place, it is important to consider their objectives carefully before you mix the two.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Regards Mike Muraguri Software Engineer Skype: mickie.mic M: +254 - 722 - 799 445
Mike, On your gmail, while viewing this thread, you should see a "Forward all" link at the top, beside the first message in this conversation. That should allow you to forward all the messages in this conversation. On 23 February 2011 14:28, Michael Muraguri <mickie.mic@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
If anyone can, please find a way to get this thread AS-IS to lecturers n concerned parties like CHE. It realy would help. Is it possible to 'export' this thread 'as-is'? I've tried to forward but can't seem to get the whole thread. Anyone who can, please spread it. I had a few of my old CS lecturers to show it to.
Let's take action.
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 1:54 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hi guys,
Impressive ideas being shared here. Going back to my very first message, I sought to know "*from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program**.*" Not to imply that what has been discussed so far is irrelevant, but rather to get some kind of aggregation of what's been shared such that it fits into the italicized and emboldened sentence above :)
I really appreciate your input.
Me.
On 23 February 2011 12:03, julianne anyim <julianneanyim@gmail.com>wrote:
I must say am so encouraged after reading this :)
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 12:34 AM, kennedy waweru <kenne2ke@gmail.com>wrote:
RAD!! thank you for putting this accross, I hope people will start to understand that which they so easily speak against.
I could not agree more here. People do not understand the objectives of an academic degree as opposed to a certification. I often find people comparing the two and throwing mud at one based on merits of the other.
My question would be simple
- Who is Charles Babbage and who trained him about the concept of the computers today? - who is john von neumann and how much did he contribute to computing? how? can he be considered a computer scientist of an IT guru? mind you he was a mathematician by profession. - very soon we will see computers made of memristors, do you know that that concept was developed by an academician a long time ago?
The problem is that many people do not really get the objective of a computer science degree. The evidence of this is one who expects to be *taught* a certain programming language instead of the underlying programming paradigm. We have over 400 programming languages!!!! who's gonna teach you that??
But a good computer science graduate who DID NOT LIVE ON THE LECTURER'S NOTES ALONE can seamlessly transfer from one programming language to another in a matter of weeks! if he so wish. Just give him/her a book! But ideally, he/she should be exploring new ways of solving computer problems and leave the implementation to IT graduates. Ideally, he should not be too engrossed in Adroid features but its underlying theoretical applications.
Who develops all these programming paradigms? Who is expected to innovate (come up with new paradigms) if not the computer science graduate? Please, put the blame where it belongs and in my opinion it belongs squarely on us students. Just observe and see how many students really read books. Or simply visit the university libraries and they will tell you for sure that the peak times are during or right before the exams. Ideally, programming languages *concepts *are taught and the most prominent are highlighted individually eg
1. introduction to programming might cover unstructured leading to structured programming (universities choose a programming language *of their choice* to introduce such concepts). The learning outcome here is a graduate who can seamlessly code in any structured programming languages like C, pascal, COBOL, basic etc but more importantly understands the reasoning underlying such methods of solving computer related problems 2. OOP and modular programming paradigms should also be taught touching the underlying concepts and hence highlighting the shift from C to C#, C++, Java etc event driven programming as a small concept based introduction 3. functional programming concepts 4. compiler construction etc
What is the expected result? Well, some of our own Linus trovalds! or even our very own bill gates!! That is a computer scientist for you. not a graduate who depends on other programming languages to code applications, an IT graduate should do that.
So please, understand the objectives of the course before bashing it and loading it with baggage it should not carry.
Of importance is also to distinguish between the objectives of IT degree and computer science degree. The products of these two degrees are meant to be different. So, if you wish to be and end user support and familiar with the latest technologies so that you can apply them then you might be better off taking an IT course and offcourse supplement it with certifications for every new technology.
Computer science is for scientists. You might develop a concept paper like Charles Babbage and john von neumann and let the engineers implement it and that is computer science for you, mind you many of these innovators were mathematicians.
Before you develop a course, please read widely on the objectives and compare with international standards like ACM and IEEE Computer Society. They have developed the minimum areas of knowledge that may be of help. This forum may just give you insights that at personal and completely unprofessional that are influenced by non-academic reasoning derived from such technical courses like CCNA and CISA that are tailor made for products of a certain company and hence do not equip you to innovate. Such courses have their place and academic courses have their place, it is important to consider their objectives carefully before you mix the two.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
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_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Regards Mike Muraguri Software Engineer Skype: mickie.mic M: +254 - 722 - 799 445
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Will forward this thread to the Director, School of Computing and Informatics, University of Nairobi On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 4:05 AM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Mike,
On your gmail, while viewing this thread, you should see a "Forward all" link at the top, beside the first message in this conversation. That should allow you to forward all the messages in this conversation.
On 23 February 2011 14:28, Michael Muraguri <mickie.mic@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
If anyone can, please find a way to get this thread AS-IS to lecturers n concerned parties like CHE. It realy would help. Is it possible to 'export' this thread 'as-is'? I've tried to forward but can't seem to get the whole thread. Anyone who can, please spread it. I had a few of my old CS lecturers to show it to.
Let's take action.
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 1:54 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hi guys,
Impressive ideas being shared here. Going back to my very first message, I sought to know "*from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program**.*" Not to imply that what has been discussed so far is irrelevant, but rather to get some kind of aggregation of what's been shared such that it fits into the italicized and emboldened sentence above :)
I really appreciate your input.
Me.
On 23 February 2011 12:03, julianne anyim <julianneanyim@gmail.com>wrote:
I must say am so encouraged after reading this :)
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 12:34 AM, kennedy waweru <kenne2ke@gmail.com>wrote:
RAD!! thank you for putting this accross, I hope people will start to understand that which they so easily speak against.
I could not agree more here. People do not understand the objectives of an academic degree as opposed to a certification. I often find people comparing the two and throwing mud at one based on merits of the other.
My question would be simple
- Who is Charles Babbage and who trained him about the concept of the computers today? - who is john von neumann and how much did he contribute to computing? how? can he be considered a computer scientist of an IT guru? mind you he was a mathematician by profession. - very soon we will see computers made of memristors, do you know that that concept was developed by an academician a long time ago?
The problem is that many people do not really get the objective of a computer science degree. The evidence of this is one who expects to be *taught* a certain programming language instead of the underlying programming paradigm. We have over 400 programming languages!!!! who's gonna teach you that??
But a good computer science graduate who DID NOT LIVE ON THE LECTURER'S NOTES ALONE can seamlessly transfer from one programming language to another in a matter of weeks! if he so wish. Just give him/her a book! But ideally, he/she should be exploring new ways of solving computer problems and leave the implementation to IT graduates. Ideally, he should not be too engrossed in Adroid features but its underlying theoretical applications.
Who develops all these programming paradigms? Who is expected to innovate (come up with new paradigms) if not the computer science graduate? Please, put the blame where it belongs and in my opinion it belongs squarely on us students. Just observe and see how many students really read books. Or simply visit the university libraries and they will tell you for sure that the peak times are during or right before the exams. Ideally, programming languages *concepts *are taught and the most prominent are highlighted individually eg
1. introduction to programming might cover unstructured leading to structured programming (universities choose a programming language *of their choice* to introduce such concepts). The learning outcome here is a graduate who can seamlessly code in any structured programming languages like C, pascal, COBOL, basic etc but more importantly understands the reasoning underlying such methods of solving computer related problems 2. OOP and modular programming paradigms should also be taught touching the underlying concepts and hence highlighting the shift from C to C#, C++, Java etc event driven programming as a small concept based introduction 3. functional programming concepts 4. compiler construction etc
What is the expected result? Well, some of our own Linus trovalds! or even our very own bill gates!! That is a computer scientist for you. not a graduate who depends on other programming languages to code applications, an IT graduate should do that.
So please, understand the objectives of the course before bashing it and loading it with baggage it should not carry.
Of importance is also to distinguish between the objectives of IT degree and computer science degree. The products of these two degrees are meant to be different. So, if you wish to be and end user support and familiar with the latest technologies so that you can apply them then you might be better off taking an IT course and offcourse supplement it with certifications for every new technology.
Computer science is for scientists. You might develop a concept paper like Charles Babbage and john von neumann and let the engineers implement it and that is computer science for you, mind you many of these innovators were mathematicians.
Before you develop a course, please read widely on the objectives and compare with international standards like ACM and IEEE Computer Society. They have developed the minimum areas of knowledge that may be of help. This forum may just give you insights that at personal and completely unprofessional that are influenced by non-academic reasoning derived from such technical courses like CCNA and CISA that are tailor made for products of a certain company and hence do not equip you to innovate. Such courses have their place and academic courses have their place, it is important to consider their objectives carefully before you mix the two.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Regards Mike Muraguri Software Engineer Skype: mickie.mic M: +254 - 722 - 799 445
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Simon, I can't see that option and forward only forwards the current message. I've tried with both Standard and Basic HTML view . If you can, please forward this to me then I'll forward it again. This is an important message - a high-rating contribution people. Keep it going. On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 3:17 PM, julianne anyim <julianneanyim@gmail.com>wrote:
Will forward this thread to the Director, School of Computing and Informatics, University of Nairobi
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 4:05 AM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Mike,
On your gmail, while viewing this thread, you should see a "Forward all" link at the top, beside the first message in this conversation. That should allow you to forward all the messages in this conversation.
On 23 February 2011 14:28, Michael Muraguri <mickie.mic@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
If anyone can, please find a way to get this thread AS-IS to lecturers n concerned parties like CHE. It realy would help. Is it possible to 'export' this thread 'as-is'? I've tried to forward but can't seem to get the whole thread. Anyone who can, please spread it. I had a few of my old CS lecturers to show it to.
Let's take action.
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 1:54 PM, Simon Mbuthia <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>wrote:
Hi guys,
Impressive ideas being shared here. Going back to my very first message, I sought to know "*from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program**.*" Not to imply that what has been discussed so far is irrelevant, but rather to get some kind of aggregation of what's been shared such that it fits into the italicized and emboldened sentence above :)
I really appreciate your input.
Me.
On 23 February 2011 12:03, julianne anyim <julianneanyim@gmail.com>wrote:
I must say am so encouraged after reading this :)
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 12:34 AM, kennedy waweru <kenne2ke@gmail.com>wrote:
RAD!! thank you for putting this accross, I hope people will start to understand that which they so easily speak against.
I could not agree more here. People do not understand the objectives of an academic degree as opposed to a certification. I often find people comparing the two and throwing mud at one based on merits of the other.
My question would be simple
- Who is Charles Babbage and who trained him about the concept of the computers today? - who is john von neumann and how much did he contribute to computing? how? can he be considered a computer scientist of an IT guru? mind you he was a mathematician by profession. - very soon we will see computers made of memristors, do you know that that concept was developed by an academician a long time ago?
The problem is that many people do not really get the objective of a computer science degree. The evidence of this is one who expects to be *taught* a certain programming language instead of the underlying programming paradigm. We have over 400 programming languages!!!! who's gonna teach you that??
But a good computer science graduate who DID NOT LIVE ON THE LECTURER'S NOTES ALONE can seamlessly transfer from one programming language to another in a matter of weeks! if he so wish. Just give him/her a book! But ideally, he/she should be exploring new ways of solving computer problems and leave the implementation to IT graduates. Ideally, he should not be too engrossed in Adroid features but its underlying theoretical applications.
Who develops all these programming paradigms? Who is expected to innovate (come up with new paradigms) if not the computer science graduate? Please, put the blame where it belongs and in my opinion it belongs squarely on us students. Just observe and see how many students really read books. Or simply visit the university libraries and they will tell you for sure that the peak times are during or right before the exams. Ideally, programming languages *concepts *are taught and the most prominent are highlighted individually eg
1. introduction to programming might cover unstructured leading to structured programming (universities choose a programming language *of their choice* to introduce such concepts). The learning outcome here is a graduate who can seamlessly code in any structured programming languages like C, pascal, COBOL, basic etc but more importantly understands the reasoning underlying such methods of solving computer related problems 2. OOP and modular programming paradigms should also be taught touching the underlying concepts and hence highlighting the shift from C to C#, C++, Java etc event driven programming as a small concept based introduction 3. functional programming concepts 4. compiler construction etc
What is the expected result? Well, some of our own Linus trovalds! or even our very own bill gates!! That is a computer scientist for you. not a graduate who depends on other programming languages to code applications, an IT graduate should do that.
So please, understand the objectives of the course before bashing it and loading it with baggage it should not carry.
Of importance is also to distinguish between the objectives of IT degree and computer science degree. The products of these two degrees are meant to be different. So, if you wish to be and end user support and familiar with the latest technologies so that you can apply them then you might be better off taking an IT course and offcourse supplement it with certifications for every new technology.
Computer science is for scientists. You might develop a concept paper like Charles Babbage and john von neumann and let the engineers implement it and that is computer science for you, mind you many of these innovators were mathematicians.
Before you develop a course, please read widely on the objectives and compare with international standards like ACM and IEEE Computer Society. They have developed the minimum areas of knowledge that may be of help. This forum may just give you insights that at personal and completely unprofessional that are influenced by non-academic reasoning derived from such technical courses like CCNA and CISA that are tailor made for products of a certain company and hence do not equip you to innovate. Such courses have their place and academic courses have their place, it is important to consider their objectives carefully before you mix the two.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Regards Mike Muraguri Software Engineer Skype: mickie.mic M: +254 - 722 - 799 445
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Regards Mike Muraguri Software Engineer Skype: mickie.mic M: +254 - 722 - 799 445
A copy of the entire conversation is at http://rapidshare.com/files/449449564/gmail.pdf
On the Right , just above the adverts, there is a Forward All button
Can a good curriculum be delivered by old school , unexposed lecturers who do no research and see how it applies to real life scenarios? I recently read a global report on education that basically dispelled certain myths about education. Key one being that the most fundamental thing to education is the instructor. Good lecturer+bad curriculum >Bad lecturer+good curriculum. Is the role of lecturers purely theory? On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 4:42 PM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
On the Right , just above the adverts, there is a Forward All button _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
rather than exporting the thread you should invite them to chime in... tunataka maoni yao hapa!!! On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 5:07 PM, Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com>wrote:
Can a good curriculum be delivered by old school , unexposed lecturers who do no research and see how it applies to real life scenarios?
I recently read a global report on education that basically dispelled certain myths about education. Key one being that the most fundamental thing to education is the instructor.
Good lecturer+bad curriculum >Bad lecturer+good curriculum.
Is the role of lecturers purely theory?
On Wed, Feb 23, 2011 at 4:42 PM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
On the Right , just above the adverts, there is a Forward All button _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
@ Kennedy Thanks for putting it so plainly. Have said this and it really pains me when i have to repeat it to my fellow country men. The reason we have electricity in our houses today is because some students took their studies seriously and understood the theoretical concepts of atoms and ions. Using the concepts, someone developed the idea of an electrical current which we so much rely on today. Please guys, let us ensure our universities teach enough theory and concepts to enable research and development. Private universities and middle level colleges are there to teach practical application of products that come out of research. This country has and continues to waste very good brains because there are no funds allocated for research and development Why are guys at CERN Large Hydron Collider (HLC), spending almost a trillion dollars just to isolate an antimatter? Also, why do you think a key requirement for any software to be documented? (we learnt this in software development) So that someone can use the manuals to learn the system without going to any class. Ideally, as a computer scientist, you can learn unix without going to anybodies class! For those not in the know, computer science is made of three interalated discipline 1. Mathematics - Theories. This where everything starts from. Abstraction e.g Number theoretic, Logarithms---> Binary system 2.. Physics - Mathematics concepts are formulated into physical. Binary representation using voltages - on and off 3. Engineering - Using the physical presentation to develop models e.g A counting register So as you see, computer science requires going beyond what is you see in the market. To make more difficult, the mathematics, physics and engineering that related to computer science, are taught to students of mathematics at masters or phd level. In addition to the core computer science subjects Let us keep the discussion flowing ________________________________ From: kennedy waweru <kenne2ke@gmail.com> To: Skunkworks Mailing List <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> Sent: Wed, February 23, 2011 11:34:44 AM Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Computer Science Curriculum Development RAD!! thank you for putting this accross, I hope people will start to understand that which they so easily speak against. I could not agree more here. People do not understand the objectives of an academic degree as opposed to a certification. I often find people comparing the two and throwing mud at one based on merits of the other. My question would be simple * Who is Charles Babbage and who trained him about the concept of the computers today? * who is john von neumann and how much did he contribute to computing? how? can he be considered a computer scientist of an IT guru? mind you he was a mathematician by profession. * very soon we will see computers made of memristors, do you know that that concept was developed by an academician a long time ago?The problem is that many people do not really get the objective of a computer science degree. The evidence of this is one who expects to be taught a certain programming language instead of the underlying programming paradigm. We have over 400 programming languages!!!! who's gonna teach you that?? But a good computer science graduate who DID NOT LIVE ON THE LECTURER'S NOTES ALONE can seamlessly transfer from one programming language to another in a matter of weeks! if he so wish. Just give him/her a book! But ideally, he/she should be exploring new ways of solving computer problems and leave the implementation to IT graduates. Ideally, he should not be too engrossed in Adroid features but its underlying theoretical applications. Who develops all these programming paradigms? Who is expected to innovate (come up with new paradigms) if not the computer science graduate? Please, put the blame where it belongs and in my opinion it belongs squarely on us students. Just observe and see how many students really read books. Or simply visit the university libraries and they will tell you for sure that the peak times are during or right before the exams. Ideally, programming languages concepts are taught and the most prominent are highlighted individually eg 1. introduction to programming might cover unstructured leading to structured programming (universities choose a programming language of their choice to introduce such concepts). The learning outcome here is a graduate who can seamlessly code in any structured programming languages like C, pascal, COBOL, basic etc but more importantly understands the reasoning underlying such methods of solving computer related problems 2. OOP and modular programming paradigms should also be taught touching the underlying concepts and hence highlighting the shift from C to C#, C++, Java etc event driven programming as a small concept based introduction 3. functional programming concepts 4. compiler construction etcWhat is the expected result? Well, some of our own Linus trovalds! or even our very own bill gates!! That is a computer scientist for you. not a graduate who depends on other programming languages to code applications, an IT graduate should do that. So please, understand the objectives of the course before bashing it and loading it with baggage it should not carry. Of importance is also to distinguish between the objectives of IT degree and computer science degree. The products of these two degrees are meant to be different. So, if you wish to be and end user support and familiar with the latest technologies so that you can apply them then you might be better off taking an IT course and offcourse supplement it with certifications for every new technology. Computer science is for scientists. You might develop a concept paper like Charles Babbage and john von neumann and let the engineers implement it and that is computer science for you, mind you many of these innovators were mathematicians. Before you develop a course, please read widely on the objectives and compare with international standards like ACM and IEEE Computer Society. They have developed the minimum areas of knowledge that may be of help. This forum may just give you insights that at personal and completely unprofessional that are influenced by non-academic reasoning derived from such technical courses like CCNA and CISA that are tailor made for products of a certain company and hence do not equip you to innovate. Such courses have their place and academic courses have their place, it is important to consider their objectives carefully before you mix the two.
This thread takes my vote rating as :10/10. Thank you for taking the time to make it such an informative discussion, and it also makes good reading too. :-)
Hear hear! Kind regards, Paul Mwachi -- iSys * Cape Office Park * Kilimani Ring Road * P O Box 17726 - 00100, Nairobi Kenya T (Off) +254 202 425 031 (Cell) +254 722 320187 E: paul@isys.co.ke * www.isys.co.ke Top Tier Software Developers - The Effective Process - Your Organization From: skunkworks-bounces@lists.my.co.ke [mailto:skunkworks-bounces@lists.my.co.ke] On Behalf Of Joram Mwinamo Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2011 4:40 PM To: Skunkworks Mailing List Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] Computer Science Curriculum Development I cant resist contributing to this. First and foremost i commend Simon Mbuthia for doing a noble thing and his university as well that wants to link its courses to reality, market research, so most of you should contribute in terms of where you see your computer science studies having prepared you or messed you up. I havent practised anything technical in comp science but still find myself more updated than your regular graduate because i read latest publications , trends and concepts. Recently I was looking for an ICT strategist and couldnt evaluate a single person from this whole network and realised they lack significantly from the market, hence its difficult to get people who can translate business concepts to technological requirements regardless of the specific vendor the technology is coming from. My contribution is that the more fundamental problem for me was the exposure of lecturers and how delinked they were from the marketplace reality. A friend told me how its not in the job description of Lecturers to do research and publish....which is unbelievable!!! I would have been interested in doing a course that would link all my comp science stuff to creating solutions for a mobile,geographically dispersed and majorly poor africa regardless of whether its programming or networking or algorithms. University should teach us to think of where to find solutions or create concepts, not teach us the final answer because reality and technology changes but fundamental things in life do not. Also if universities could have market experts who are day to day practitioners invited to give talks within classes, and more real life AFRICAN case studies that would be super! Over and out On Tue, Feb 22, 2011 at 4:20 PM, Theus Owuor <kootie73@gmail.com<mailto:kootie73@gmail.com>> wrote: Better software development skills On Feb 21, 2011 4:16 PM, "Simon Mbuthia" <simon.mbuthia@gmail.com<mailto:simon.mbuthia@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hello techies,
I have been invited by my Alma Mater for a brainstorming session with a view to improve their Computer Science degree program. I thought it would be a good thing to first of all hear from employers and supervisors of Computer Science degree holders what they think most graduates lack that would be worth considering when coming up with a computer science degree program.
Your thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.
Muchas gracias,
Me.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke<mailto:Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> http://orion.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke -- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch(c) -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
participants (31)
-
[Brainiac] -
aki -
Andrew Wachira -
Arthur Buliva -
Bernard Owuor -
Dennis Kioko -
Erick Njenga -
Geoffrey Mimano -
Haggai Nyang -
Jason Mule -
Joram Mwinamo -
julianne anyim -
Kamiru Mwangi Samuel -
kennedy waweru -
Laban Mwangi -
mabeya conseray -
Michael Muraguri -
Mike M. -
Muoki Maingi -
Nd'wex Common -
Ndungi Kyalo -
One Murithi -
Paul Kevin -
Paul Mwachi -
Peter Karunyu -
Phares Kariuki -
Richard Gathogo -
Shadrack Mwaniki -
Simon Mbuthia -
solomon kariri -
Theus Owuor