For OOP programmers or general ones, what plan or methodology do you use for deriving variables ? Suppose this in design phase of the programme ( Before I do sniper, its "kungu-fu" skunk a simple 2D game similar to super mario to see if I can do this thing.... ) : Assume that I'm writing a game plan for a game called "kungfu-skunk" . I have created a requirements and design plan. Some of my basic requirements are these : - Player can move left / right of screen - Player can jump - Player can box and kick opponents I've already defined my Player Object, classes,methods and properties. What would be variables for Player and how can I derive these? I know one is position on screen. Rgds -- "..the game you imagined and the game that will result may not have a lot in common. Rapid prototyping is key.. " - someone.
I think I'll re-phrase the question incase it was wrong in some way. Ok, coders out there, do you write Variables on the fly i.e add ones as you write code or do you have a plan ahead for the Variables. Variables can be global, public, private and declaring them in the right portion of code will allow/deny access or functionality. How then do you derive the variables because they will be referenced by different tasks or scripts?
Am sure you are an OO programmer and therefore just make a smart use the three pillars/concepts of OO ie polymorphism, inheritance and encapsulation. Best Regards, Wilson. On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 9:26 AM, aki <aki275@googlemail.com> wrote:
I think I'll re-phrase the question incase it was wrong in some way. Ok, coders out there, do you write Variables on the fly i.e add ones as you write code or do you have a plan ahead for the Variables. Variables can be global, public, private and declaring them in the right portion of code will allow/deny access or functionality. How then do you derive the variables because they will be referenced by different tasks or scripts?
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You know you can never plan ahead for everything. You always makethe major plans like how the app will flow, what conditions to set e.g where to save, e.t.c. However, when adding new functionality or when taking care of some bug or e.t.c, you will obviously have to add more variables. However, its always good to start with the whole concept in mind and budget for known issues/functionality. On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 9:58 AM, Wilson Bandi <bandson67@gmail.com> wrote:
Am sure you are an OO programmer and therefore just make a smart use the three pillars/concepts of OO ie polymorphism, inheritance and encapsulation.
Best Regards,
Wilson.
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 9:26 AM, aki <aki275@googlemail.com> wrote:
I think I'll re-phrase the question incase it was wrong in some way. Ok, coders out there, do you write Variables on the fly i.e add ones as you write code or do you have a plan ahead for the Variables. Variables can be global, public, private and declaring them in the right portion of code will allow/deny access or functionality. How then do you derive the variables because they will be referenced by different tasks or scripts?
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-- Kind Regards,
Wilson Bandi
Mobile: +254-726-786481
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PS: If you need to access a certain variable in class B within class A and you have no foreknowledge of whether class B is initialized, then always use static variables. e.g if this is java.Within class B I will have public class B{ ..... public static String accessFromA = "This is from B"; ..... } from A, i will access it thus public class A{ ..... String fromB = B.accessFromA; .... } On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 10:32 AM, Frankline Chitwa <frank.chitwa@gmail.com>wrote:
You know you can never plan ahead for everything. You always makethe major plans like how the app will flow, what conditions to set e.g where to save, e.t.c. However, when adding new functionality or when taking care of some bug or e.t.c, you will obviously have to add more variables. However, its always good to start with the whole concept in mind and budget for known issues/functionality.
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 9:58 AM, Wilson Bandi <bandson67@gmail.com> wrote:
Am sure you are an OO programmer and therefore just make a smart use the three pillars/concepts of OO ie polymorphism, inheritance and encapsulation.
Best Regards,
Wilson.
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 9:26 AM, aki <aki275@googlemail.com> wrote:
I think I'll re-phrase the question incase it was wrong in some way. Ok, coders out there, do you write Variables on the fly i.e add ones as you write code or do you have a plan ahead for the Variables. Variables can be global, public, private and declaring them in the right portion of code will allow/deny access or functionality. How then do you derive the variables because they will be referenced by different tasks or scripts?
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-- Kind Regards,
Wilson Bandi
Mobile: +254-726-786481
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-- www.golavish.com - The travel and leisure www.raccuddasys.com - code Development issues
Yup, the use of the singleton. You will need this at some point in your app...e.g. since it's a 2D game you'll only need one playable area/level at a time...so it's wise that you include it in your design to take care of objects that will only have one instance. You can for example name it the GamePlay class (singleton) and in it have a var named level...you get the drift...also really useful for vars you want shared across the whole app without worrying about accidentally creating new instances. On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 10:40 AM, Frankline Chitwa <frank.chitwa@gmail.com>wrote:
PS: If you need to access a certain variable in class B within class A and you have no foreknowledge of whether class B is initialized, then always use static variables.
e.g if this is java.Within class B I will have
public class B{ ..... public static String accessFromA = "This is from B"; ..... }
from A, i will access it thus
public class A{ ..... String fromB = B.accessFromA; ....
}
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 10:32 AM, Frankline Chitwa <frank.chitwa@gmail.com
wrote:
You know you can never plan ahead for everything. You always makethe major plans like how the app will flow, what conditions to set e.g where to save, e.t.c. However, when adding new functionality or when taking care of some bug or e.t.c, you will obviously have to add more variables. However, its always good to start with the whole concept in mind and budget for known issues/functionality.
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 9:58 AM, Wilson Bandi <bandson67@gmail.com>wrote:
Am sure you are an OO programmer and therefore just make a smart use the three pillars/concepts of OO ie polymorphism, inheritance and encapsulation.
Best Regards,
Wilson.
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 9:26 AM, aki <aki275@googlemail.com> wrote:
I think I'll re-phrase the question incase it was wrong in some way. Ok, coders out there, do you write Variables on the fly i.e add ones as you write code or do you have a plan ahead for the Variables. Variables can be global, public, private and declaring them in the right portion of code will allow/deny access or functionality. How then do you derive the variables because they will be referenced by different tasks or scripts?
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-- Kind Regards,
Wilson Bandi
Mobile: +254-726-786481
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Hey Aki, Maybe you should take a look at this - it should answer most of your questions. It's a good example of simple 2D game programming. http://aiti.mit.edu/courses/projects/invadersProject.zip -Billy 2010/3/24 Haggai Nyang <haggai.nyang@gmail.com>
Yup, the use of the singleton. You will need this at some point in your app...e.g. since it's a 2D game you'll only need one playable area/level at a time...so it's wise that you include it in your design to take care of objects that will only have one instance. You can for example name it the GamePlay class (singleton) and in it have a var named level...you get the drift...also really useful for vars you want shared across the whole app without worrying about accidentally creating new instances.
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 10:40 AM, Frankline Chitwa <frank.chitwa@gmail.com
wrote:
PS: If you need to access a certain variable in class B within class A and you have no foreknowledge of whether class B is initialized, then always use static variables.
e.g if this is java.Within class B I will have
public class B{ ..... public static String accessFromA = "This is from B"; ..... }
from A, i will access it thus
public class A{ ..... String fromB = B.accessFromA; ....
}
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 10:32 AM, Frankline Chitwa < frank.chitwa@gmail.com> wrote:
You know you can never plan ahead for everything. You always makethe major plans like how the app will flow, what conditions to set e.g where to save, e.t.c. However, when adding new functionality or when taking care of some bug or e.t.c, you will obviously have to add more variables. However, its always good to start with the whole concept in mind and budget for known issues/functionality.
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 9:58 AM, Wilson Bandi <bandson67@gmail.com>wrote:
Am sure you are an OO programmer and therefore just make a smart use the three pillars/concepts of OO ie polymorphism, inheritance and encapsulation.
Best Regards,
Wilson.
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 9:26 AM, aki <aki275@googlemail.com> wrote:
I think I'll re-phrase the question incase it was wrong in some way. Ok, coders out there, do you write Variables on the fly i.e add ones as you write code or do you have a plan ahead for the Variables. Variables can be global, public, private and declaring them in the right portion of code will allow/deny access or functionality. How then do you derive the variables because they will be referenced by different tasks or scripts?
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-- Kind Regards,
Wilson Bandi
Mobile: +254-726-786481
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-- www.golavish.com - The travel and leisure www.raccuddasys.com - code Development issues
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@Frankline, thnks for your input @Haggai, thnks too. @Billy, thnks too. Gents, am gently sharing my opinion. I'm aware of and read about the various ways but what I can share is that I'm unable to find a definitive answer to deriving variables. For me personally, I refuse to code without any solid foundation of what am doing and until I find some solid answers, I cannot proceed beyond my visio plan/drawing. I refuse to add stuff on the fly, because a poor plan means unexpected issues down the road, especially with core of the code.* *I would add stuff on the fly when either an upgrade or newer levels are expected. I'm trying to avoid a situation where after coding most of the game only to discover that I'm spending time fixing it. There are multiple objects that carry code in "Kungfu-Skunk" and there's still a long way to go between graphics code, keybd/mouse, loaders etc. Please try and think along the lines that if you were a coder and doing an application design, how would you then define its variables? What would make you say eg Ahhahhaa...this is a business calculation application, so I need a constant somewhere like say VAT. So now you have derived VAT as a variable of your application. And we know every few years, govts tend to change so variable VAT cannot be a constant. Asante. :-) On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 10:54 AM, Haggai Nyang <haggai.nyang@gmail.com>wrote:
Yup, the use of the singleton. You will need this at some point in your app...e.g. since it's a 2D game you'll only need one playable area/level at a time...so it's wise that you include it in your design to take care of objects that will only have one instance. You can for example name it the GamePlay class (singleton) and in it have a var named level...you get the drift...also really useful for vars you want shared across the whole app without worrying about accidentally creating new instances.
Well its true, you cannot make a solid app without adequate info. Research!! That is the one thing everything depends on. I can see one impossible aspect you are trying to achieve. You want to be an overnight expert. You will have to make your app 3 or 4 times before mastering everything you are doing. Believe me. Research what your game will do. Make models, make prototypes, make mistakes. If you are willing to spend time on this, eventually you will make a solid app. On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 11:15 AM, aki <aki275@googlemail.com> wrote:
@Frankline, thnks for your input @Haggai, thnks too. @Billy, thnks too.
Gents, am gently sharing my opinion. I'm aware of and read about the various ways but what I can share is that I'm unable to find a definitive answer to deriving variables. For me personally, I refuse to code without any solid foundation of what am doing and until I find some solid answers, I cannot proceed beyond my visio plan/drawing. I refuse to add stuff on the fly, because a poor plan means unexpected issues down the road, especially with core of the code.* *I would add stuff on the fly when either an upgrade or newer levels are expected. I'm trying to avoid a situation where after coding most of the game only to discover that I'm spending time fixing it. There are multiple objects that carry code in "Kungfu-Skunk" and there's still a long way to go between graphics code, keybd/mouse, loaders etc.
Please try and think along the lines that if you were a coder and doing an application design, how would you then define its variables? What would make you say eg Ahhahhaa...this is a business calculation application, so I need a constant somewhere like say VAT. So now you have derived VAT as a variable of your application. And we know every few years, govts tend to change so variable VAT cannot be a constant.
Asante. :-)
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 10:54 AM, Haggai Nyang <haggai.nyang@gmail.com>wrote:
Yup, the use of the singleton. You will need this at some point in your app...e.g. since it's a 2D game you'll only need one playable area/level at a time...so it's wise that you include it in your design to take care of objects that will only have one instance. You can for example name it the GamePlay class (singleton) and in it have a var named level...you get the drift...also really useful for vars you want shared across the whole app without worrying about accidentally creating new instances.
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@Frankline, I really appreciate your input. In the original thread I had asked if anyone uses a particular plan or methodology to derive variables and I gave an example of a design stage that I'm looking at. The design stage can only come around if enough research has gone into the requirements stage. Trust me, it is not that simple and a steeep learning curve, variables is one tiny portion of the program and placing them correctly within the code is very important. Imagine you were a software development consultant and given a blank page to comeup with project requirements, flow and functionality. From what you write into the project is a blueprint for the development phase of the project. Its like a blueprint for a house, you cannot build a house first then make its blueprint plans later. For a house, you can derive many variables. Some like electrical sockets, plumbing outlets, drainage, volume and storage of water just by knowing what each floor is going to do. The blueprint for an office block will be different from a residential one. Anyway, I'm still researching and hopefully be able to comeup with an answer that makes sense on paper first. :-) Rgds. On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 11:20 PM, Frankline Chitwa <frank.chitwa@gmail.com> wrote:
Well its true, you cannot make a solid app without adequate info. Research!! That is the one thing everything depends on. I can see one impossible aspect you are trying to achieve. You want to be an overnight expert. You will have to make your app 3 or 4 times before mastering everything you are doing. Believe me.
Research what your game will do. Make models, make prototypes, make mistakes. If you are willing to spend time on this, eventually you will make a solid app.
My 2 cents. variables as i understand them are storage for data that is generated or will be used by the app. Now if you did a walk thru of the app and there are variables that will be required by the app as the basic settings, and then there those that will need to store and update during game play or as the app functions. For example do you need variables that will only be mapped to the player and what do they have to store and why. What will be the use of data stored in variable x and what module will use it that why i think you can start defining the scope... On Thu, Mar 25, 2010 at 7:37 AM, aki <aki275@googlemail.com> wrote:
@Frankline, I really appreciate your input. In the original thread I had asked if anyone uses a particular plan or methodology to derive variables and I gave an example of a design stage that I'm looking at. The design stage can only come around if enough research has gone into the requirements stage. Trust me, it is not that simple and a steeep learning curve, variables is one tiny portion of the program and placing them correctly within the code is very important. Imagine you were a software development consultant and given a blank page to comeup with project requirements, flow and functionality. From what you write into the project is a blueprint for the development phase of the project. Its like a blueprint for a house, you cannot build a house first then make its blueprint plans later. For a house, you can derive many variables. Some like electrical sockets, plumbing outlets, drainage, volume and storage of water just by knowing what each floor is going to do. The blueprint for an office block will be different from a residential one.
Anyway, I'm still researching and hopefully be able to comeup with an answer that makes sense on paper first. :-)
Rgds.
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 11:20 PM, Frankline Chitwa <frank.chitwa@gmail.com> wrote:
Well its true, you cannot make a solid app without adequate info. Research!! That is the one thing everything depends on. I can see one impossible aspect you are trying to achieve. You want to be an overnight expert. You will have to make your app 3 or 4 times before mastering everything you are doing. Believe me.
Research what your game will do. Make models, make prototypes, make mistakes. If you are willing to spend time on this, eventually you will make a solid app.
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niiiiccee! now we are talking. :-) What you list below is the stage I've been in for the past 2 weeks. I want to really refine it, use as a template guideline so that vars can be visualized in the mind just by looking at the code/object. Like say when an architect talks about a door for a house, he does not need to go out and measure a door each time to place it in a drawing. He knows what it is and what he can do with it. On Thu, Mar 25, 2010 at 12:12 PM, kris njoroge <krsnjo@gmail.com> wrote:
My 2 cents. variables as i understand them are storage for data that is generated or will be used by the app. Now if you did a walk thru of the app and there are variables that will be required by the app as the basic settings, and then there those that will need to store and update during game play or as the app functions. For example do you need variables that will only be mapped to the player and what do they have to store and why. What will be the use of data stored in variable x and what module will use it that why i think you can start defining the scope...
Of course you do realize that architects have had thorough education plus a lot of experience in their field. Why cant you trust a fresh graduate with building KICC? Experience. in everything new, you have to experiment and prod and probe before coming up with a working model. After your experiments you will know which variables are needed to achieve a purpose. You cannot simply visualize all of them. Unless you have a lot of experience.......like....... me.......... On 3/25/10, aki <aki275@googlemail.com> wrote:
niiiiccee! now we are talking. :-) What you list below is the stage I've been in for the past 2 weeks. I want to really refine it, use as a template guideline so that vars can be visualized in the mind just by looking at the code/object. Like say when an architect talks about a door for a house, he does not need to go out and measure a door each time to place it in a drawing. He knows what it is and what he can do with it.
On Thu, Mar 25, 2010 at 12:12 PM, kris njoroge <krsnjo@gmail.com> wrote:
My 2 cents. variables as i understand them are storage for data that is generated or will be used by the app. Now if you did a walk thru of the app and there are variables that will be required by the app as the basic settings, and then there those that will need to store and update during game play or as the app functions. For example do you need variables that will only be mapped to the player and what do they have to store and why. What will be the use of data stored in variable x and what module will use it that why i think you can start defining the scope...
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On Thu, Mar 25, 2010 at 7:37 AM, aki <aki275@googlemail.com> wrote:
@Frankline, I really appreciate your input. In the original thread I had asked if anyone uses a particular plan or methodology to derive variables and I gave an example of a design stage that I'm looking at. The design stage can only come around if enough research has gone into the requirements stage. Trust me, it is not that simple and a steeep learning curve, variables is one tiny portion of the program and placing them correctly within the code is very important. Imagine you were a software development consultant and given a blank page to comeup with project requirements, flow and functionality. From what you write into the project is a blueprint for the development phase of the project. Its like a blueprint for a house, you cannot build a house first then make its blueprint plans later. For a house, you can derive many variables. Some like electrical sockets, plumbing outlets, drainage, volume and storage of water just by knowing what each floor is going to do. The blueprint for an office block will be different from a residential one.
Anyway, I'm still researching and hopefully be able to comeup with an answer that makes sense on paper first. :-)
Rgds.
Aki, Software development isn't quite like the other engineering disciplines. In software development, "the source code is the design (and not the product)". The whole process of writing your application actually involves designing it. Things change all the time as you go along. I'd say you shouldn't worry too much about having a perfect "design" on paper before writing a single line of code. You just need to start with a general "architecture" of the system, which will also change as you flesh it out in code. Check out these pages at the Portland Pattern Repository Wiki: < http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?WhatIsSoftwareDesign>, < http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?TheSourceCodeIsTheDesign>, and < http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?TheSourceCodeIsTheProduct>. Joseph.
@Wilson, thnks for that. I'm having one of those days where all I can say is programming is screwed up! ( imo ) it at times defies logic though the whole thing is about logic. One concern that is leading me on the deriving variables path is to avoid a memory trap, I think it was stack/heap and how objects get referenced/loaded. Variables can hold a set data type while objects can hold a lists of variables. The issue is back to derive the correct variables which then allows me to place them within objects or main.
From OOP eye, if you imagined an object and would write its code in your mind, how then would you derive its variables? Rememmber that methods also have properties. And Variables have get/set properties too.
On Wed, Mar 24, 2010 at 9:58 AM, Wilson Bandi <bandson67@gmail.com> wrote:
Am sure you are an OO programmer and therefore just make a smart use the three pillars/concepts of OO ie polymorphism, inheritance and encapsulation.
Best Regards,
Wilson.
participants (7)
-
aki -
Billy -
Frankline Chitwa -
Haggai Nyang -
Joseph Wayodi -
kris njoroge -
Wilson Bandi