PetrolTracker: fleshing out the devil in the details...
As we discuss the housekeeping rules (in a separate thread), let's also discuss the actual project scope on this thread. Very few project ideas survive in their original form, most go thro' an iterative refinement. The strength of an idea isn't in its immutability ("unchangeable-ness"), but rather in its ability to act as a good seed for the n-th generation ideas that actually get implemented.
From some of the responses to my earlier proposal for this project (originally an idea from my brother), quite a few other people had similar ideas. Let's decide which aspects of the various projects get implemented, why they should be implemented, and in what version(s).
I'll start by outlining my ideas and reasons; please add your ideas and let's come to a rough consensus fairly quickly. Feel free as well to constructively critique other people's ideas. This stage should act as a filter to isolate unworkable ideas, or ideas that really should be a separate project altogether. Ok, here we go: - find out the cheapest petrol prices closest to you - report/update the prices of a petrol station - to simplify the project: - restrict the petrol stations only to Nairobi (for version 1) - the only interface will be SMS (subsequent versions may include other interfaces: web, mobile apps, etc etc) - pros: no one needs a smartphone, or data plan for this. Most ppl are already comfortable with SMSes. - cons: a lot of really snazzy, graphical features need a browser (or a capable smart/phone). But subsequent versions can include more advanced interfaces for phones that can support it. - use twitter's already-existing interface to receive and send SMSes. - pros: free, many good libraries exist, easy to quickly get started - cons: how many ppl in Nairobi use, or know about, twitter? How easy is it to quickly get a user sending/receiving messages on twitter via their phone? - to include as many people as possible: - use SMS as the main interface - allow a very fluid submission/query syntax (e.g. allow SMS-isms, abbreviations, incorrect street names etc etc There is a tension between making life simpler for the end-users (e.g. a forgiving language parser) and making life harder for the developers. It is easier, from a programming perspective, to only allow strict grammar in the SMSes sent, but that will likely make the application unusable for most people (imagine trying to query/submit petrol prices while driving, in perfect grammar!). Whenever possible, I tend to prefer transferring complexity away from the end-user and towards the programmer. These are some of the trade-offs we will have to decide on. Over to the community for a constructive back-and-forth... Saidi
A clarification: all of the prices in the system are user-generated via the same SMS interface. So the SMS syntax that needs to be developed should also cater for submitting prices. As with any user-submitted data, issues of quality-control, authentication, trust etc etc also come up. For instance, the system should not give the same amount of "trust" to prices from someone who has a record of giving the wrong info as it would to someone who has a pretty good track record. Perhaps this area needs its own thread? Anyone feeling "sufficiently philanthropic?" Saidi On Thu, Aug 5, 2010 at 6:32 PM, saidimu apale <saidimu@gmail.com> wrote:
As we discuss the housekeeping rules (in a separate thread), let's also discuss the actual project scope on this thread.
Very few project ideas survive in their original form, most go thro' an iterative refinement. The strength of an idea isn't in its immutability ("unchangeable-ness"), but rather in its ability to act as a good seed for the n-th generation ideas that actually get implemented.
From some of the responses to my earlier proposal for this project (originally an idea from my brother), quite a few other people had similar ideas. Let's decide which aspects of the various projects get implemented, why they should be implemented, and in what version(s).
I'll start by outlining my ideas and reasons; please add your ideas and let's come to a rough consensus fairly quickly. Feel free as well to constructively critique other people's ideas. This stage should act as a filter to isolate unworkable ideas, or ideas that really should be a separate project altogether.
Ok, here we go:
- find out the cheapest petrol prices closest to you
- report/update the prices of a petrol station
- to simplify the project: - restrict the petrol stations only to Nairobi (for version 1) - the only interface will be SMS (subsequent versions may include other interfaces: web, mobile apps, etc etc) - pros: no one needs a smartphone, or data plan for this. Most ppl are already comfortable with SMSes. - cons: a lot of really snazzy, graphical features need a browser (or a capable smart/phone). But subsequent versions can include more advanced interfaces for phones that can support it. - use twitter's already-existing interface to receive and send SMSes. - pros: free, many good libraries exist, easy to quickly get started - cons: how many ppl in Nairobi use, or know about, twitter? How easy is it to quickly get a user sending/receiving messages on twitter via their phone?
- to include as many people as possible: - use SMS as the main interface - allow a very fluid submission/query syntax (e.g. allow SMS-isms, abbreviations, incorrect street names etc etc
There is a tension between making life simpler for the end-users (e.g. a forgiving language parser) and making life harder for the developers. It is easier, from a programming perspective, to only allow strict grammar in the SMSes sent, but that will likely make the application unusable for most people (imagine trying to query/submit petrol prices while driving, in perfect grammar!).
Whenever possible, I tend to prefer transferring complexity away from the end-user and towards the programmer. These are some of the trade-offs we will have to decide on.
Over to the community for a constructive back-and-forth...
Saidi
the implementation of the platform seems similar to ushahidi in several aspects. That would also be another line of thought, building this on top of ushahidi and then coding the additional functionality not provided by ushahidi, especially responding to user SMS.
Additional features can be quickly built and added int the Ushahidi platform using the new plugin architecture. Erik Hersman www.Ushahidi.com Twitter: @whiteafrican On Aug 6, 2010, at 10:23 AM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
the implementation of the platform seems similar to ushahidi in several aspects. That would also be another line of thought, building this on top of ushahidi and then coding the additional functionality not provided by ushahidi, especially responding to user SMS. _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
I agree with Dennis, Ushahidi has made very good use of the Google Maps API and already works with SMS and Twitter, the whole point of Open Source is to take up such and build it to suit specific needs. However, Ushahidi is built on a framework which means you have to stick to this specific framework on any extensions of the code (For best practice). This is a very interesting project, am interested in working on it, is it open? David. On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Erik Hersman <erik@zungu.com> wrote:
Additional features can be quickly built and added int the Ushahidi platform using the new plugin architecture.
Erik Hersman
www.Ushahidi.com Twitter: @whiteafrican
On Aug 6, 2010, at 10:23 AM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
the implementation of the platform seems similar to ushahidi in several aspects. That would also be another line of thought, building this on top of ushahidi and then coding the additional functionality not provided by ushahidi, especially responding to user SMS. _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f...
------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- ------------- http://blog.majibu.com
Hi David, Yes, it's available at http://github.com/ushahidi Also, you can find out more on the wiki (http://wiki.ushahidi.com), forums (http://forums.ushahidi.com) and here's a blog post by David Kobia on the plugin architecture: http://blog.ushahidi.com/index.php/2010/06/29/on-the-ushahidi-plugin-system/ For anyone just interested in playing around and aren't up to doing it on their own server, you can try out our new cloud-based service: www.crowdmap.com which is in beta as of this week. Erik Hersman www.ushahidi.com www.afrigadget.com | www.whiteafrican.com | @whiteafrican On Aug 6, 2010, at 11:35 AM, David Mugo wrote:
I agree with Dennis, Ushahidi has made very good use of the Google Maps API and already works with SMS and Twitter, the whole point of Open Source is to take up such and build it to suit specific needs. However, Ushahidi is built on a framework which means you have to stick to this specific framework on any extensions of the code (For best practice).
This is a very interesting project, am interested in working on it, is it open?
David.
On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Erik Hersman <erik@zungu.com> wrote: Additional features can be quickly built and added int the Ushahidi platform using the new plugin architecture.
Erik Hersman
www.Ushahidi.com Twitter: @whiteafrican
On Aug 6, 2010, at 10:23 AM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
the implementation of the platform seems similar to ushahidi in several aspects. That would also be another line of thought, building this on top of ushahidi and then coding the additional functionality not provided by ushahidi, especially responding to user SMS. _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- ------------- http://blog.majibu.com _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Thanks Erik, the plugin approach is a great way to do this! I will definitely be looking through that. David. On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 3:07 PM, Erik Hersman <erik@zungu.com> wrote:
Hi David,
Yes, it's available at http://github.com/ushahidi
Also, you can find out more on the wiki (http://wiki.ushahidi.com), forums (http://forums.ushahidi.com) and here's a blog post by David Kobia on the plugin architecture: http://blog.ushahidi.com/index.php/2010/06/29/on-the-ushahidi-plugin-system/
For anyone just interested in playing around and aren't up to doing it on their own server, you can try out our new cloud-based service: www.crowdmap.com which is in beta as of this week.
Erik Hersman
www.ushahidi.com www.afrigadget.com | www.whiteafrican.com <http://www.afrigadget.com> | @whiteafrican <http://twitter.com/whiteafrican>
On Aug 6, 2010, at 11:35 AM, David Mugo wrote:
I agree with Dennis, Ushahidi has made very good use of the Google Maps API and already works with SMS and Twitter, the whole point of Open Source is to take up such and build it to suit specific needs. However, Ushahidi is built on a framework which means you have to stick to this specific framework on any extensions of the code (For best practice).
This is a very interesting project, am interested in working on it, is it open?
David.
On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Erik Hersman <erik@zungu.com> wrote:
Additional features can be quickly built and added int the Ushahidi platform using the new plugin architecture.
Erik Hersman
www.Ushahidi.com Twitter: @whiteafrican
On Aug 6, 2010, at 10:23 AM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
the implementation of the platform seems similar to ushahidi in several aspects. That would also be another line of thought, building this on top of ushahidi and then coding the additional functionality not provided by ushahidi, especially responding to user SMS. _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f...
------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- ------------- http://blog.majibu.com _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- ------------- http://blog.majibu.com
Great stuff about Mocality and Ushahidi. The main point about PetrolTracker is as a learning tool on brainstorming and creating web-scale apps on the cheap, literally from scratch to launch. All the decisions and trade-offs that go into the project are made by the community, and the project discussions that go on are on this mailing-list. The project is wholly owned by Skunkworks-KE members, and therefore lives or dies at the members discretion. Having a tangible project greatly aids in learning, as opposed to theory-only. Plus, the feeling of being an integral part of a growing project is thrilling, to say the least. Saidi On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 8:14 AM, David Mugo <raidarmax@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Erik, the plugin approach is a great way to do this! I will definitely be looking through that.
David.
On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 3:07 PM, Erik Hersman <erik@zungu.com> wrote:
Hi David,
Yes, it's available at http://github.com/ushahidi
Also, you can find out more on the wiki (http://wiki.ushahidi.com), forums (http://forums.ushahidi.com) and here's a blog post by David Kobia on the plugin architecture: http://blog.ushahidi.com/index.php/2010/06/29/on-the-ushahidi-plugin-system/
For anyone just interested in playing around and aren't up to doing it on their own server, you can try out our new cloud-based service: www.crowdmap.com which is in beta as of this week.
Erik Hersman
www.ushahidi.com www.afrigadget.com | www.whiteafrican.com <http://www.afrigadget.com> | @whiteafrican <http://twitter.com/whiteafrican>
On Aug 6, 2010, at 11:35 AM, David Mugo wrote:
I agree with Dennis, Ushahidi has made very good use of the Google Maps API and already works with SMS and Twitter, the whole point of Open Source is to take up such and build it to suit specific needs. However, Ushahidi is built on a framework which means you have to stick to this specific framework on any extensions of the code (For best practice).
This is a very interesting project, am interested in working on it, is it open?
David.
On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Erik Hersman <erik@zungu.com> wrote:
Additional features can be quickly built and added int the Ushahidi platform using the new plugin architecture.
Erik Hersman
www.Ushahidi.com Twitter: @whiteafrican
On Aug 6, 2010, at 10:23 AM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
the implementation of the platform seems similar to ushahidi in several aspects. That would also be another line of thought, building this on top of ushahidi and then coding the additional functionality not provided by ushahidi, especially responding to user SMS. _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f...
------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- ------------- http://blog.majibu.com _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- ------------- http://blog.majibu.com
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
This is a very interesting project, am interested in working on it, is it open?
Yeah it's open, the point is for skunks to learn, grow and run away with it. Join any of the threads prefixed "PetrolTracker" and express your passion. There are already active discussions going on, and some open questions/tasks that need owners/drivers. Saidi On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 4:35 AM, David Mugo <raidarmax@gmail.com> wrote:
I agree with Dennis, Ushahidi has made very good use of the Google Maps API and already works with SMS and Twitter, the whole point of Open Source is to take up such and build it to suit specific needs. However, Ushahidi is built on a framework which means you have to stick to this specific framework on any extensions of the code (For best practice).
This is a very interesting project, am interested in working on it, is it open?
David.
On Fri, Aug 6, 2010 at 10:51 AM, Erik Hersman <erik@zungu.com> wrote:
Additional features can be quickly built and added int the Ushahidi platform using the new plugin architecture.
Erik Hersman
www.Ushahidi.com Twitter: @whiteafrican
On Aug 6, 2010, at 10:23 AM, Dennis Kioko <dmbuvi@gmail.com> wrote:
the implementation of the platform seems similar to ushahidi in several aspects. That would also be another line of thought, building this on top of ushahidi and then coding the additional functionality not provided by ushahidi, especially responding to user SMS. _______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f...
------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- ------------- http://blog.majibu.com
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Server donations spreadsheet
http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AopdHkqSqKL-dHlQVTMxU1VBdU1BSWJxdy1f... ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
participants (4)
-
David Mugo -
Dennis Kioko -
Erik Hersman -
saidimu apale