In the KE tech world and Silicon Valley--An amatuer view
Just been catching up on a thread on the other list, and something caught my attention. The subject line is to do with Silicon Valley. The more I look at the overall picture of the approach towards what ICT needs and can be done, the more I'm convinced that generally ( *not all* ) many kenyans are far more interested in mastering to become *brokers* that actually doing something. It seems becoming a broker is a very easy thing. I've read various articles and excuses as to why VCs, angle investors and others--mostly external-- should provide financing for tech projects etc. Yet, so far I've not seen any info about tech projects that has been funded by such. What I even fail to understand is that the impression of someone funding you to write some program, yet our local banks quite easily provide unsecured loans to a certain level. And taking software developement, the investment costs are quite low compared to generally most business that have to retain stock/asset values. *Something strange is being groomed in our tech culture for the last few years, and it seems it maybe an easier way for brokers to earn incomes or perks with a twist.* Now please someone tell me if the chinese back street programmers/developers are preparing a well written document to be presented to some VC, angel or Silicon Valley type operation so that they can get funding to "survive" while doing some development? I'm sure I saw a picture of a QUAD SIM phone somewhere.......... Is it just me who sees it like this, or do I have the wrong impressions? Corrections welcome...
Further to my earlier email, I came across this article ( http://thechina.biz/china-industries/china-technology/VC-invasion/ ) that made me laugh and so start to question very deeply on what exactly has been/is going on in KE? Why the talk of Technology Parks etc when we should first be asking this first: 1) Please name a Kenyan high tech company : ( Ps: supplying or implementing servers, switches, computers, stationary of any kind is not high tech stuff, in the context of high tech companies. China offers its local high tech companies special incentives. What are we going to use the Tech Parks for? ) 2) Please name a Website that fits a VC idea and whether any kenyan website or application has been achieved this status? : 3) Nokia and its 1Million dollar prize spread over a number of years for a kenyan company. This to me is even more baffling now, because was eg Nokia trying to use the region as a marketing tool via the "code for prize" and how much has been achieved of the system. Ofcourse, if the farmers have started using the system and can relate to a life-changing experience, well done. But, I never read in the local dailies of the impact yet. For me the strangeness of the whole VC, angel etc seems like some sort of an *invasion of the tech sector.* But I cannot find the right term for it because brokerage seems unprofessional while outright fake impressions seem rather difficult to relate. So the question comes down to this: What exactly is going on? Me amateur thots. :-)
As a final contribution to this thread, I take you on a comparison road. This is what Kenyans brokers are trying to copy : http://www.flickr.com/photos/zavie/2870555712/ while if you google any chinese software company, such things don't exist. Yeah, a coffee bar and lounge are really cool ideas but are they really productive? The answer to such will be clear in the next 3 years when China exceeds the US as a global business leader while companies like e.g. google maybe looking at retrenchments and cost cutting measures to stay afloat. What about Nokia, how much market share has it lost over the few years? So in a nutshell, does any kenyan or company need funding to develop software or its ideas as a business model? Not really. We don't even need any Tech Parks or the rest, what we need are companies and individuals that push out the tech stuff from the corner of his/her car garage and make something of it. The Tech Parks are really political ideas and will only benefit those who seek the above flickr link. Short term thinking, money to be made by using the word TECHNOLOGY yet not a TECHNOLOGIST. Me thots. Over and out. :-)
Right on time Aki. I believe the same in that those who are pushing for all these parks and VCs and political will are inherently not techies. Google offers free computing power via app engine and I think amazon ec2 also offers a similar incentive for low usage. Am not a coder by heart but hard coded solutions and paradigms don't need millions in vc funds. they need drive mission and dedication. It sounds like another hyped dream which will get funds allocated and little progress. And I predict we will be labelled as harbingers of negative energy. On 5/25/11, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
As a final contribution to this thread, I take you on a comparison road. This is what Kenyans brokers are trying to copy : http://www.flickr.com/photos/zavie/2870555712/ while if you google any chinese software company, such things don't exist. Yeah, a coffee bar and lounge are really cool ideas but are they really productive? The answer to such will be clear in the next 3 years when China exceeds the US as a global business leader while companies like e.g. google maybe looking at retrenchments and cost cutting measures to stay afloat. What about Nokia, how much market share has it lost over the few years?
So in a nutshell, does any kenyan or company need funding to develop software or its ideas as a business model? Not really. We don't even need any Tech Parks or the rest, what we need are companies and individuals that push out the tech stuff from the corner of his/her car garage and make something of it. The Tech Parks are really political ideas and will only benefit those who seek the above flickr link. Short term thinking, money to be made by using the word TECHNOLOGY yet not a TECHNOLOGIST.
Me thots. Over and out. :-)
-- Regards, Mark Mwangi http://mwangy.posterous.com
No offence but a relevant question VC's are asking is do we have products worth funding?
@Mark, @John, you are absolutely spot on.
just thinking out loud ..... wonder whether the Chinese government will ever allow a kenyan company to tarmac their roads.... pray, if we spent half the money, we are, on building thika road and sponsored 50 of our best brains to china as apprentices in their road building projects and they do the whole nine yards, i.e studying and building their experience base.... then we can do the roads for ourselves and the region ... perhaps? when the government tenders for ICT projects, most of the awarded companies have a mother international company behind the bid....so when the job commences they hire (if they get to it) guys to do the manual part of the job( read fixing and setting up servers, installing programs, scanning documents et al.) and take the bulk of the money and leave some for the brokers... my point ... perhaps the ICT board should push the serikali to only award locally developed concepts and programs... and this demand creation will snowball, even better sponsor the best pool again and let them learn from those mother companies and hence we develop our own resources.... i bet the annals of history will tell that's exactly what china did.... my 2 shillings On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 9:21 AM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
@Mark, @John, you are absolutely spot on.
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-- It is difficult to see the picture when you are inside of the frame "When I was 5 years old, my mother always told me that happiness was the key to life. When I went to school, they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up. I wrote down "happy". They told me I didn’t understand the assignment. I told them they didn’t understand life." — John Lennon
it takes a while to sponsor students to go learn and then experiment. Its a great idea but they then need to start on smaller and less urgent projects and make their way up. However, hope they dont go the Mugoya way
my point ... perhaps the ICT board should push the serikali to only award locally developed concepts and programs... and this demand creation will snowball, even better sponsor the best pool again and let them learn from those mother companies and hence we develop our own resources.... i bet the annals of history will tell that's exactly what china did....
I agree with this, but we can't just start giving local developers preference because, SOME local developers have a tendency to do software that is 100% pure crap. To filter the idiot programmers from those who know what they are doing, we need standards. So that for any software to be considered for purchase by the government, it must have been developed under and meet certain standards.
Guys, ( in response to who replied ) the matters of software quality and certifications are a process. Tech parks etc will not guarantee this nor will they create a better or professional environment. This industry needs a change from the ground, and to begin that process would be a change in the way software piracy is dealt with, better facilities from the govt in terms of access to low interest loans and tax reductions to create an investment environment for many kenyans seeking to or if they already are in the industry. The general view held high is that each industry has to be competitve, innovative and adapt to be profitable/survive the markets. There seems to be a hand's off policy by the current govt that "we create the infrastructure, you build on it". This is bunch of marketing bullocks! What exactly is the govt doing in the software industry to groom it for the future, especially that we have a vision to achieve? Trying to sell empty ideas to VCs or encouraging some strange mentality that I already wrote about earlier? When we want to talk with VCs, angle or other investors, let us have a running concept that at least meets an annual turnover of some sort. Then it all makes sense to grow and urge foreign investors to partner if they wish too. If not, we find kenyan investors willing to push the industry forward. Some thots. :-)
My opinion is that there are endless opportunities to develop software in Kenya. I find that we almost want the incentives to come before we even write a line of code. I would rather have a group of software coders petitioning the govt after they have created something and have challenges selling or pushing it into the market because of piracy, taxation or unfair competition Lets just say, people are not patient enough to create,test and sell over the long term, everyone(exaggerated of course) wants VCs to put in 1 million USD before they even write a single line of code. On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 5:17 PM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
Guys, ( in response to who replied ) the matters of software quality and certifications are a process. Tech parks etc will not guarantee this nor will they create a better or professional environment. This industry needs a change from the ground, and to begin that process would be a change in the way software piracy is dealt with, better facilities from the govt in terms of access to low interest loans and tax reductions to create an investment environment for many kenyans seeking to or if they already are in the industry.
The general view held high is that each industry has to be competitve, innovative and adapt to be profitable/survive the markets. There seems to be a hand's off policy by the current govt that "we create the infrastructure, you build on it". This is bunch of marketing bullocks! What exactly is the govt doing in the software industry to groom it for the future, especially that we have a vision to achieve? Trying to sell empty ideas to VCs or encouraging some strange mentality that I already wrote about earlier?
When we want to talk with VCs, angle or other investors, let us have a running concept that at least meets an annual turnover of some sort. Then it all makes sense to grow and urge foreign investors to partner if they wish too. If not, we find kenyan investors willing to push the industry forward.
Some thots. :-)
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-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
so true On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 5:28 PM, Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com>wrote:
My opinion is that there are endless opportunities to develop software in Kenya. I find that we almost want the incentives to come before we even write a line of code. I would rather have a group of software coders petitioning the govt after they have created something and have challenges selling or pushing it into the market because of piracy, taxation or unfair competition
Lets just say, people are not patient enough to create,test and sell over the long term, everyone(exaggerated of course) wants VCs to put in 1 million USD before they even write a single line of code.
On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 5:17 PM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
Guys, ( in response to who replied ) the matters of software quality and certifications are a process. Tech parks etc will not guarantee this nor will they create a better or professional environment. This industry needs a change from the ground, and to begin that process would be a change in the way software piracy is dealt with, better facilities from the govt in terms of access to low interest loans and tax reductions to create an investment environment for many kenyans seeking to or if they already are in the industry.
The general view held high is that each industry has to be competitve, innovative and adapt to be profitable/survive the markets. There seems to be a hand's off policy by the current govt that "we create the infrastructure, you build on it". This is bunch of marketing bullocks! What exactly is the govt doing in the software industry to groom it for the future, especially that we have a vision to achieve? Trying to sell empty ideas to VCs or encouraging some strange mentality that I already wrote about earlier?
When we want to talk with VCs, angle or other investors, let us have a running concept that at least meets an annual turnover of some sort. Then it all makes sense to grow and urge foreign investors to partner if they wish too. If not, we find kenyan investors willing to push the industry forward.
Some thots. :-)
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Sent from my Voice Recognition Watch© -------------------------------------------------------------------- Our greatest fear is not that we are inadequate,but that we are powerful beyond measure.It is our light, not our darkness, that frightens us.There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people won't feel insecure around you.As we let our own light shine, we consciously give other people permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our fear,our presence automatically liberates others.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
@Joram, agreed and spot on. Some additional amateur thots: - What is the catalyst for developers/software companies to take a keen interest and make the industry grow? a) For a start there is no catalyst. If you develop any software and want to charge for it, your billing charges have to include VAT charges i.e services rendered. For some company that can easily download pirated software and deploy it, there could cares less about the anything developed locally especially for sale. This is where the ICT Board or even the Min of Info in govt need to streamline. Since piracy cannot be totally eradicated, we need to compete against it. Produce local software and badge it locally = no VAT for product or services rendered. b) Because a lot of a developers time is spent on research, testing and debugging, the time utilized is counter productive towards a final product. During this period, any serious developer will not be able to sustain themselves just on research and therefore need a cushion. This cushion can be in the form of tax incentives where the goal is NOT to produce a big bang project per year but produce multiple low priced apps. The more the apps produced, the more the tax incentives earned that will be re-introduced into research. Bottonline = If one can do 50 apps a year with a succes rate of some, well they can be laughing to the bank. Maybe they may not pay any taxes, so there is need to establish a threshold. c) ICT Board ( developer/software companies section ) needs to produce a monthly summary of kenyan applications that have met requirements and are badged accordingly. This also goes for websites. It can then take this summary and help bridge the gap between investors and the developers. It does not need to be in this manner but the concept of marketing locally and within the region. If the ICT Board feels that there is plenty of potential with a certain app or website etc, they can even connect to further sources. d) When there are students who leave local universities and are very good at programming, ICT Board should have a fund for such. They should be able to walk out of the Uni and go straight to the ICT Board ( some fund section ) and pickup a laptop, modem and a loan based on good results or programming abilities. The loans will be low interest, and one requirement is that the student will not go and open an expensive office. They will be required to work from home to keep their overheads very low and that within the first year they will be expected to produce at least 2 commercial successful applications. These applications will be hosted on the ICT Board server, and publicly available for purchase or further investments. e) To build local companies: ICT Board should encourage a monthly meet of developers, investors and potential clients. If ICT Board can bring together even 5 kenyans who share a common goal of creating a developer business, then the process will surely have begun. Therefore, the core of the meet is to build long term partnerships and local investments. Because everyone has a particular skillset, these meets could create a powerful business system that is aware of investor needs and also business projections. I could go on but let me brake here! There is much ICT Board and govt can do to nurture the industry in its infant stage. Once we are able to build on at least 50 SME companies with certain turnovers, then the Tech Parks and the coffee/lounges seem a likely possibility. The next step would be to take this young companies, and look at the Tech Parks. Bang! We have started a proper system that could lead to Kenya really becoming a top developer hub within a few years. On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 5:28 PM, Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com>wrote:
My opinion is that there are endless opportunities to develop software in Kenya. I find that we almost want the incentives to come before we even write a line of code. I would rather have a group of software coders petitioning the govt after they have created something and have challenges selling or pushing it into the market because of piracy, taxation or unfair competition
Lets just say, people are not patient enough to create,test and sell over the long term, everyone(exaggerated of course) wants VCs to put in 1 million USD before they even write a single line of code.
@Aki http://www.fastcompany.com/1755089/legendary-investor-peter-thiel-names-drea... On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 9:33 PM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
@Joram, agreed and spot on. Some additional amateur thots:
- What is the catalyst for developers/software companies to take a keen interest and make the industry grow?
a) For a start there is no catalyst. If you develop any software and want to charge for it, your billing charges have to include VAT charges i.e services rendered. For some company that can easily download pirated software and deploy it, there could cares less about the anything developed locally especially for sale. This is where the ICT Board or even the Min of Info in govt need to streamline. Since piracy cannot be totally eradicated, we need to compete against it. Produce local software and badge it locally = no VAT for product or services rendered.
b) Because a lot of a developers time is spent on research, testing and debugging, the time utilized is counter productive towards a final product. During this period, any serious developer will not be able to sustain themselves just on research and therefore need a cushion. This cushion can be in the form of tax incentives where the goal is NOT to produce a big bang project per year but produce multiple low priced apps. The more the apps produced, the more the tax incentives earned that will be re-introduced into research. Bottonline = If one can do 50 apps a year with a succes rate of some, well they can be laughing to the bank. Maybe they may not pay any taxes, so there is need to establish a threshold.
c) ICT Board ( developer/software companies section ) needs to produce a monthly summary of kenyan applications that have met requirements and are badged accordingly. This also goes for websites. It can then take this summary and help bridge the gap between investors and the developers. It does not need to be in this manner but the concept of marketing locally and within the region. If the ICT Board feels that there is plenty of potential with a certain app or website etc, they can even connect to further sources.
d) When there are students who leave local universities and are very good at programming, ICT Board should have a fund for such. They should be able to walk out of the Uni and go straight to the ICT Board ( some fund section ) and pickup a laptop, modem and a loan based on good results or programming abilities. The loans will be low interest, and one requirement is that the student will not go and open an expensive office. They will be required to work from home to keep their overheads very low and that within the first year they will be expected to produce at least 2 commercial successful applications. These applications will be hosted on the ICT Board server, and publicly available for purchase or further investments.
e) To build local companies: ICT Board should encourage a monthly meet of developers, investors and potential clients. If ICT Board can bring together even 5 kenyans who share a common goal of creating a developer business, then the process will surely have begun. Therefore, the core of the meet is to build long term partnerships and local investments. Because everyone has a particular skillset, these meets could create a powerful business system that is aware of investor needs and also business projections.
I could go on but let me brake here! There is much ICT Board and govt can do to nurture the industry in its infant stage. Once we are able to build on at least 50 SME companies with certain turnovers, then the Tech Parks and the coffee/lounges seem a likely possibility. The next step would be to take this young companies, and look at the Tech Parks. Bang! We have started a proper system that could lead to Kenya really becoming a top developer hub within a few years.
On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 5:28 PM, Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com>wrote:
My opinion is that there are endless opportunities to develop software in Kenya. I find that we almost want the incentives to come before we even write a line of code. I would rather have a group of software coders petitioning the govt after they have created something and have challenges selling or pushing it into the market because of piracy, taxation or unfair competition
Lets just say, people are not patient enough to create,test and sell over the long term, everyone(exaggerated of course) wants VCs to put in 1 million USD before they even write a single line of code.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Endless
Stumbled across this on the link... *Eden Full* is the 19-year-old Canadian founder of Roseicollis Technologies,
a solar energy start- up that deploys her patent-pending inventions in established and emerging markets. Currently electrifying two villages of 1000 citizens in Kenya, Eden’s SunSaluter is a solar panel tracking system that optimizes energy collection by up to 40 percent for only $10. She began developing her social enterprise when she was 15.
@Haggai, this has made my day :-) So now I can imagine this "wooii, tuko na sitima!! huyu mtoto ni mjanga sana...". Yet, the greatness of Ushaidi & crowd sourcing has not been used in the recent Tornado calamities in the US because the UN was not involved? Now this below is the example of the mentality I mentioned in the start off the thread. It called brokers "attracting foreign investments in technology" and its a tried and tested formula. Ever wondered why Kibera needs to be mapped? I think for me is to look at the developers industry situation in kenya over the next two years, and if things have not changed significantly then I believe Seychelles offers a good model for developers and companies. Who knows, the next "kijiji application" may be written for kenya by kenyans abroad and we can leave the kenyan technology dream on its eventual crash when funding runs out. On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 10:19 PM, Haggai Nyang <haggai.nyang@gmail.com>wrote:
Stumbled across this on the link...
*Eden Full* is the 19-year-old Canadian founder of Roseicollis
Technologies, a solar energy start- up that deploys her patent-pending inventions in established and emerging markets. Currently electrifying two villages of 1000 citizens in Kenya, Eden’s SunSaluter is a solar panel tracking system that optimizes energy collection by up to 40 percent for only $10. She began developing her social enterprise when she was 15.
@Haggai, some humor from the power of marketing. :-)) Some humor, and this story is fictitious: Date : May 27th 2011 Location : Kenya Title : Saving Kenya’s Villages, the Village Barber can finally use an electric razor on solar optimized technology Author : who cares “When a 19 year old Canadian start off her company RT Tech, she had no idea how one of her inventions would drastically change the life of a village barber nor the life of at least a 1000 kenyans in some remote village. Many parts of Canada have remote areas that are in need of such inventions; however the winter climate, long periods of overcast skies and the elevation of the sun during daylight transit made the invention a bit impractical to implement. So what was the next best destination? Yes, you guessed it. Africa and its sunny skies where one can be guaranteed of at least 11 hours of sunlight each day. The Belgians avoided the sunlight problem altogether and put up wind turbines right out in the sea so as to harness the power of wind. No one knows for sure how the location was decided, whether though an NGO or through a Kenyan Broker. Heck, the village gets free electricity and the broker gets to look good that there is foreign investment in the technology sector, so yeah why not. And the inventor get funding for its projects, so everyone is happy. Hurray! Power to the arrangement. After the system was implemented, we met the local barber, known as Mr Barber. He was totally blown away by the solar tracking concept but admitted he knew nothing about it. He was however eager to show us his tool of the trade. An Electric Razor! What an Electric Razor it was. It had multiple speed controls, could shave a beard in a matter of minutes with a trimming tool and once in a while the electric razor would be used for culling sheep wool. He was the happiest person around and business was booming. Before the arrival of the solar powered electricity generation system, Mr Barber would often complain about using a hand operated manual clipper as it gave him sores fingers and even exposed him to a health hazard. His clients were also not too impressed as they had to wait longer to be served. Now Mr Barber smiles and says “ business is good” and that he is saving up on small profits that he makes to buy more Electric Razors and setup a proper Salon for his clients. Mr Barber is very thankful to the Canadian Angel because the Govt has not provided electricity to the area for many years despite pleas. On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 10:19 PM, Haggai Nyang <haggai.nyang@gmail.com>wrote:
Stumbled across this on the link...
*Eden Full* is the 19-year-old Canadian founder of Roseicollis
Technologies, a solar energy start- up that deploys her patent-pending inventions in established and emerging markets. Currently electrifying two villages of 1000 citizens in Kenya, Eden’s SunSaluter is a solar panel tracking system that optimizes energy collection by up to 40 percent for only $10. She began developing her social enterprise when she was 15.
@aki, you have some excellent ideas, but let me challenge you a bit.... Write an email to Bitange Ndemo, ask him for a meeting, print these ideas and go discuss with him. Chances are you will get Kukubo in that meeting.
From experience, both of them are very approachable.
Bottom line, don't wait for someone to take these excellent ideas you have and do something with them, you yourself take the initiative! On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 9:33 PM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
@Joram, agreed and spot on. Some additional amateur thots:
- What is the catalyst for developers/software companies to take a keen interest and make the industry grow?
a) For a start there is no catalyst. If you develop any software and want to charge for it, your billing charges have to include VAT charges i.e services rendered. For some company that can easily download pirated software and deploy it, there could cares less about the anything developed locally especially for sale. This is where the ICT Board or even the Min of Info in govt need to streamline. Since piracy cannot be totally eradicated, we need to compete against it. Produce local software and badge it locally = no VAT for product or services rendered.
b) Because a lot of a developers time is spent on research, testing and debugging, the time utilized is counter productive towards a final product. During this period, any serious developer will not be able to sustain themselves just on research and therefore need a cushion. This cushion can be in the form of tax incentives where the goal is NOT to produce a big bang project per year but produce multiple low priced apps. The more the apps produced, the more the tax incentives earned that will be re-introduced into research. Bottonline = If one can do 50 apps a year with a succes rate of some, well they can be laughing to the bank. Maybe they may not pay any taxes, so there is need to establish a threshold.
c) ICT Board ( developer/software companies section ) needs to produce a monthly summary of kenyan applications that have met requirements and are badged accordingly. This also goes for websites. It can then take this summary and help bridge the gap between investors and the developers. It does not need to be in this manner but the concept of marketing locally and within the region. If the ICT Board feels that there is plenty of potential with a certain app or website etc, they can even connect to further sources.
d) When there are students who leave local universities and are very good at programming, ICT Board should have a fund for such. They should be able to walk out of the Uni and go straight to the ICT Board ( some fund section ) and pickup a laptop, modem and a loan based on good results or programming abilities. The loans will be low interest, and one requirement is that the student will not go and open an expensive office. They will be required to work from home to keep their overheads very low and that within the first year they will be expected to produce at least 2 commercial successful applications. These applications will be hosted on the ICT Board server, and publicly available for purchase or further investments.
e) To build local companies: ICT Board should encourage a monthly meet of developers, investors and potential clients. If ICT Board can bring together even 5 kenyans who share a common goal of creating a developer business, then the process will surely have begun. Therefore, the core of the meet is to build long term partnerships and local investments. Because everyone has a particular skillset, these meets could create a powerful business system that is aware of investor needs and also business projections.
I could go on but let me brake here! There is much ICT Board and govt can do to nurture the industry in its infant stage. Once we are able to build on at least 50 SME companies with certain turnovers, then the Tech Parks and the coffee/lounges seem a likely possibility. The next step would be to take this young companies, and look at the Tech Parks. Bang! We have started a proper system that could lead to Kenya really becoming a top developer hub within a few years.
On Thu, May 26, 2011 at 5:28 PM, Joram Mwinamo <joram.mwinamo@gmail.com>wrote:
My opinion is that there are endless opportunities to develop software in Kenya. I find that we almost want the incentives to come before we even write a line of code. I would rather have a group of software coders petitioning the govt after they have created something and have challenges selling or pushing it into the market because of piracy, taxation or unfair competition
Lets just say, people are not patient enough to create,test and sell over the long term, everyone(exaggerated of course) wants VCs to put in 1 million USD before they even write a single line of code.
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@Peter, thanks and am sure you are correct that Ndemo and Kukubo are very approachable people, surely a breed of intelligent and reasonable individuals. However, by now you must know that for me to be objective and offer any sort of critic, I cannot be part of the system. This is what helps me understand and bring out the issues and also stops me from becoming a member say e.g. the iHub or even when I proposed the software developers association. By not being in the system, nor having any conflicts of interest, is a tight line to walk and talk. I cannot be pro/against ICT board and not look at the realities in the industry. This is why the other list, i.e. the stakeholders one, is just talk and they never have any intelligent meaningful discussions because I'm certain that every individual within that list is tied to the govt in some business way or another. If Ndemo and Kukubo really want to help Kenya achieve its goals within the tech sector, they will only find the very partial ideas/comments on a stakeholder list. But they will surely find it here on skunks however unreasonable discussion they might come across on this list. It is for us to ensure that the issues are brought out and hopefully find their way into the system for further discussions and implementation. Asante. :-) On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 8:17 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
@aki, you have some excellent ideas, but let me challenge you a bit....
Write an email to Bitange Ndemo, ask him for a meeting, print these ideas and go discuss with him. Chances are you will get Kukubo in that meeting. From experience, both of them are very approachable.
Bottom line, don't wait for someone to take these excellent ideas you have and do something with them, you yourself take the initiative!
Aki my friend that argument is not convincing. There are too many armchair philosophers and critics. It is very easy to point out issues. It is another altogether to suck it up and walk the talk. Who do you expect to change things if everyone uses the argument that they want to be objective therefore they won't do anything? Hapo my guy -- i disagree. On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 9:43 AM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
@Peter, thanks and am sure you are correct that Ndemo and Kukubo are very approachable people, surely a breed of intelligent and reasonable individuals. However, by now you must know that for me to be objective and offer any sort of critic, I cannot be part of the system. This is what helps me understand and bring out the issues and also stops me from becoming a member say e.g. the iHub or even when I proposed the software developers association. By not being in the system, nor having any conflicts of interest, is a tight line to walk and talk. I cannot be pro/against ICT board and not look at the realities in the industry. This is why the other list, i.e. the stakeholders one, is just talk and they never have any intelligent meaningful discussions because I'm certain that every individual within that list is tied to the govt in some business way or another.
If Ndemo and Kukubo really want to help Kenya achieve its goals within the tech sector, they will only find the very partial ideas/comments on a stakeholder list. But they will surely find it here on skunks however unreasonable discussion they might come across on this list. It is for us to ensure that the issues are brought out and hopefully find their way into the system for further discussions and implementation.
Asante. :-)
On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 8:17 AM, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
@aki, you have some excellent ideas, but let me challenge you a bit....
Write an email to Bitange Ndemo, ask him for a meeting, print these ideas and go discuss with him. Chances are you will get Kukubo in that meeting. From experience, both of them are very approachable.
Bottom line, don't wait for someone to take these excellent ideas you have and do something with them, you yourself take the initiative!
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@Rad, appreciate your input. :-) As far as I see it, ICT Board and even Dr Ndemo don't need me to waste their time sitting in some office discussing what? Proposals that are public knowledge on this list? I'm already walking the talk here on this list with some proposals, though am not yet an expert. But you too can help as you have been in the industry for long and are well versed with all the problems. Suppose that we draft up proposals right on this list and want to see an implemenation date, how do we go about it? Do any of my proposals even have any value? There are software developer companies on this list, yet none has responded. What do you think? Rgds. On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 10:10 AM, Rad! <conradakunga@gmail.com> wrote:
Aki my friend that argument is not convincing.
There are too many armchair philosophers and critics. It is very easy to point out issues.
It is another altogether to suck it up and walk the talk.
Who do you expect to change things if everyone uses the argument that they want to be objective therefore they won't do anything?
Hapo my guy -- i disagree.
@Aki You failed to show up for the Skunkworks meeting discussing some of the initiatives... :-). We have many things that ail our tech sector, but more positives really than negatives... VC is generally a good thing. Why? Most tech companies fail not because of poor technology, but poor business sense, which is what VC's bring to the table. The problem is in managing them. We have no clue how to negotiate with them etc... As a country shy of natural resources, we need whatever capital can be injected, we don't have the population/mineral muscle that countries like China enjoy.... On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 10:27 AM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
@Rad, appreciate your input. :-)
As far as I see it, ICT Board and even Dr Ndemo don't need me to waste their time sitting in some office discussing what? Proposals that are public knowledge on this list? I'm already walking the talk here on this list with some proposals, though am not yet an expert.
But you too can help as you have been in the industry for long and are well versed with all the problems. Suppose that we draft up proposals right on this list and want to see an implemenation date, how do we go about it? Do any of my proposals even have any value? There are software developer companies on this list, yet none has responded.
What do you think?
Rgds.
On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 10:10 AM, Rad! <conradakunga@gmail.com> wrote:
Aki my friend that argument is not convincing.
There are too many armchair philosophers and critics. It is very easy to point out issues.
It is another altogether to suck it up and walk the talk.
Who do you expect to change things if everyone uses the argument that they want to be objective therefore they won't do anything?
Hapo my guy -- i disagree.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- With Regards, Phares Kariuki | T: +254 734 810 802 | E: pkariuki@gmail.com | Twitter: kaboro | Skype: kariukiphares | B: http://www.kaboro.com/ |
@Phares, my bad, I know that I've not attended any of skunksworks meeting discussions. However, not attending has not stopped me from following plenty of what goes on and also realise that much more needs to be done. That is why I try and raise the issues so that before we jump at any conclusions, we have had a view and opinion from others who are also equally good at what they do. Going on VCs etc, as I wrote earlier, that we need a system that can take something and make it different. VCs etc I have nothing against except that when we are grooming people to think along these lines, we end up doing nothing. I honestly don't know why you cannot see the pitfalls of such a system. Trying to create Tech Parks may help short term international investors to camp at the parks but for kenyans in the sector the govt has not done anything to nurture or even groom the sector, left it to "market forces shall decide your fate, its business as usual". I've a question for you. Hope you had a chance to read my humor article. Suppose a kenyan was to create a solar tracking system, which VC would fund it ? Obviously supplying 1000 people with Solar power is no small feat in terms of costs. On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Phares Kariuki <pkariuki@gmail.com> wrote:
@Aki You failed to show up for the Skunkworks meeting discussing some of the initiatives... :-).
We have many things that ail our tech sector, but more positives really than negatives...
VC is generally a good thing. Why? Most tech companies fail not because of poor technology, but poor business sense, which is what VC's bring to the table. The problem is in managing them. We have no clue how to negotiate with them etc... As a country shy of natural resources, we need whatever capital can be injected, we don't have the population/mineral muscle that countries like China enjoy....
I'd like to wrap up this thread, and in summary write that I've listed my thoughts on the subject. My hope is that at least some points could prove to be valuable to those in the industry. While we may not have the financial might, all we are asking is that ICT Board, Dr Ndemo and others in the govt look into creating the developers/software industry a lucrative market for both kenyans and international investors. Anything less than this, I'm sure any serious kenyan developer business will eventually want to enjoy the same benefits that are offered to international investors elsewhere. Rgds.
Aki, There are problems, we don't refuse, but that does not mean we should suffer from the Ostrich effect. There is a lot that can be done, one of them, and key is education... what people like iHub, Nailab etc are doing. If you know how to engage with a VC, you will benefit... There are many companies today which have benefited greatly from VC and employ hundreds of people and really are entrepreneurial success stories... What we should be trying to figure out is why the companies succeeded.... Kenyan software developers also need to learn a lot... It's telling that the largest IT firms in Kenya are run by accountants/engineers, not software developers... We need to learn from people like Google and get some 'adult supervision' as it were, as in the formative stages of a business, fiscal mismanagement spells doom for an otherwise promising organization. Tech parks are useful if you think about the cost of infrastructure... It's easier to design a city rigged with fibre from day one, then to deal with all the problems Nairobi has... The challenge of course is getting the requisite pull to get the developers etc there... On Fri, May 27, 2011 at 6:02 PM, aki <aki275@gmail.com> wrote:
I'd like to wrap up this thread, and in summary write that I've listed my thoughts on the subject. My hope is that at least some points could prove to be valuable to those in the industry. While we may not have the financial might, all we are asking is that ICT Board, Dr Ndemo and others in the govt look into creating the developers/software industry a lucrative market for both kenyans and international investors. Anything less than this, I'm sure any serious kenyan developer business will eventually want to enjoy the same benefits that are offered to international investors elsewhere.
Rgds.
_______________________________________________ Skunkworks mailing list Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------ Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- With Regards, Phares Kariuki | T: +254 734 810 802 | E: pkariuki@gmail.com | Twitter: kaboro | Skype: kariukiphares | B: http://www.kaboro.com/ |
Phares, some comments inline below. :-) On Mon, May 30, 2011 at 10:51 AM, Phares Kariuki <pkariuki@gmail.com> wrote:
Aki,
There are problems, we don't refuse, but that does not mean we should suffer from the Ostrich effect.
Ostrich effect, not really. Its the broker effect that we really need to watch out for. This is far more dangerious to the economy than hiding one's head in the sand.
There is a lot that can be done, one of them, and key is education... what people like iHub, Nailab etc are doing. If you know how to engage with a VC, you will benefit... There are many companies today which have benefited greatly from VC and employ hundreds of people and really are entrepreneurial success stories... What we should be trying to figure out is why the companies succeeded....
Nailab and Ihub are good examples, however they could also breeding a VC dependency culture and outlook. The same could be said of Mobile apps and partnerships with Mobile operators is breeding the same mentality. Success stories are inspirational but the bottom line is results, and results can only take place if the structure around the potential successes of any projects is possible. Nailab and iHub do not need to exist, are they trying to duplicate what KICTB should be doing in the first place, seems to me the board is using the Ostrich effect too well, especially when Kenya is looking at becoming a tech hub in some way.
Kenyan software developers also need to learn a lot... It's telling that the largest IT firms in Kenya are run by accountants/engineers, not software developers... We need to learn from people like Google and get some 'adult supervision' as it were, as in the formative stages of a business, fiscal mismanagement spells doom for an otherwise promising organization.
Absolutely, it is the business community that sells, not developers. Therefore, and as I wrote in some of my listed points, it should be imperative that KICTB look at monthly get together's between the developer/software companies and investors/VCs etc to charter a plan and goals towards becoming effective. Talk shows are nice and informative, but the bottomline is very evident when nothing surfaces in terms of results. Please try and give an example of someone who attended Google talk etc ( google trying to sell its apps in the market therefore looking for brokers, same goes for other vendors ) and found it inspirational enough to create their own search engine or some crawler. Are we saying that we lack the capacity to think? That is definately depressing if the case so.
Tech parks are useful if you think about the cost of infrastructure... It's easier to design a city rigged with fibre from day one, then to deal with all the problems Nairobi has... The challenge of course is getting the requisite pull to get the developers etc there...
Before we think about the locations and a Tech Park, let us first build on successful high tech ( e.g. software developer companies--includes web design companies that can have an annual turnover ) businesses that are able to take advantage of the environment and create the lounge/modern tech sector look and appeal. Without the minimum threshold, we are most likely looking at a Tech Park that closely resembling a free rent and almost zero output facilities. This is why I believe that we need to do a country summary and see which country offers developers a proper business environment and compare what kenya is not doing. Then it will become very clear that developers have no excuse not to develop, even from home keeping overheads to a bare minimum, while the bussiness aspect would later need some capital injection before taking on any VCs. Rgds. :-)
participants (12)
-
aki -
Dennis Kioko -
Haggai Nyang -
John Maina -
Joram Mwinamo -
Mark Mwangi -
Paul Kevin -
Peter Karunyu -
Phares Kariuki -
Rad! -
Roba gikonyo -
skunk works