Hi Peter, 1.PHP is easy, not hidden and can easily be ported to higher versions of Apache\PHP\mysql and immediately shoot,if logic and patterns are not that complicated.Very few guys out there have added obfuscations.PHP is the cheapest in terms of hosting in the clouds and locally. You will also find many guys who can read and write something(edit) in PHP that Java. 2.MySQL was bought by Oracle so that they can pick better side while killing it, it now moving fast to closed source sides,those guys die hard Open Source evangelist have now moved to start Maria DB.Java was almost crippled (Removing all useful APIs) if Google wasn't there to save their soul as they have invested so much. Mysql is the most used DB in the web and local apps by multi - billion corporates that could by oracle products. 4.My Customers had never asked to buy the source- codes.By the way that would cost them more in terms of initial cost and maintenance.They will rarely , get a cheap programmer, they will always find some problems when their in house programmer depart, new one has to learn hard, we would find it very hard to add new features when things have changed so much(incompatible).So far our customers have tried to define what they need and we do add or modify very quickly to an extent they they think they do`nt need any more support support for the foreseeable future, with as stable as it would be the customer would never need us until they change how they do business,which means any software can get as far as that distance. By the way our software products are by far the cheapest,customizable,scalable from the front side than many software around.Any client that is that greedy to think of tempering with code,might have chosen a wrong product. or have a wrong intentions.We add,customize features by charging a very low amount of money than any proud programmer around.While people thing of outsourcing project around the world others think of taking every slice in each layer to themselves. By the way many outsource project are like "survey and free way to use others skills and ideas", and somewhere these guys would start to pull a string leaving others hanging.Do you want me to hurt you...?M-Pesa was a good exploitation of bright minds in Kenya.Bright minds in Kenya contributed so much to Mpesa thing,they pushed from taking off, diversified and finally someone would pull a string with patent things.How should those guys be paid or benefit in terms of royalties ? If you like source code you have two ways..by the product, or outsource a task to us, or sub contract us..we would more than happy. Nicholas Peter Mmasi.
>>>>>>>> From: Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com>
Hi Nicholas, I find your analysis of open source software quite interesting, please clarify the following points: 1. Never bother with non-PHP based open source apps Why is this so? Why PHP? 2. Java and MySQL are owned by Oracle Why is the ownership of these two by Oracle such as bad thing for open source software? 3. Choose a product which one can continue using even after the vendor collapses When you are offering Easysale POS or Mayo School ERP to customers, do you include the source code so that they can continue using/improving/modifying it should your company collapse? I have zero experience in the field of making and selling software, thus my questions above may seem a bit obvious, so please, educate a brother :-)
Closed-versus-open is a never ending debate. Both have pros and cons, choose the one you can live with and run with it. Openbravo has a community edition here<http://www.openbravo.com/product-editions>, There is even an openbravo fork here <http://www.unicenta.com/> . You can probably find more here too<http://www.google.com>:-) On 21 July 2013 01:00, Kinpro Computers-All IT soutions < kinprocomputers@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Peter,
1.PHP is easy, not hidden and can easily be ported to higher versions of Apache\PHP\mysql and immediately shoot,if logic and patterns are not that complicated.Very few guys out there have added obfuscations.PHP is the cheapest in terms of hosting in the clouds and locally. You will also find many guys who can read and write something(edit) in PHP that Java.
2.MySQL was bought by Oracle so that they can pick better side while killing it, it now moving fast to closed source sides,those guys die hard Open Source evangelist have now moved to start Maria DB.Java was almost crippled (Removing all useful APIs) if Google wasn't there to save their soul as they have invested so much. Mysql is the most used DB in the web and local apps by multi - billion corporates that could by oracle products.
4.My Customers had never asked to buy the source- codes.By the way that would cost them more in terms of initial cost and maintenance.They will rarely , get a cheap programmer, they will always find some problems when their in house programmer depart, new one has to learn hard, we would find it very hard to add new features when things have changed so much(incompatible).So far our customers have tried to define what they need and we do add or modify very quickly to an extent they they think they do`nt need any more support support for the foreseeable future, with as stable as it would be the customer would never need us until they change how they do business,which means any software can get as far as that distance.
By the way our software products are by far the cheapest,customizable,scalable from the front side than many software around.Any client that is that greedy to think of tempering with code,might have chosen a wrong product. or have a wrong intentions.We add,customize features by charging a very low amount of money than any proud programmer around.While people thing of outsourcing project around the world others think of taking every slice in each layer to themselves.
By the way many outsource project are like "survey and free way to use others skills and ideas", and somewhere these guys would start to pull a string leaving others hanging.Do you want me to hurt you...?M-Pesa was a good exploitation of bright minds in Kenya.Bright minds in Kenya contributed so much to Mpesa thing,they pushed from taking off, diversified and finally someone would pull a string with patent things.How should those guys be paid or benefit in terms of royalties ?
If you like source code you have two ways..by the product, or outsource a task to us, or sub contract us..we would more than happy.
Nicholas Peter Mmasi.
>>>>>>>>> From: Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com>
Hi Nicholas, I find your analysis of open source software quite interesting, please clarify the following points:
1. Never bother with non-PHP based open source apps Why is this so? Why PHP?
2. Java and MySQL are owned by Oracle Why is the ownership of these two by Oracle such as bad thing for open source software?
3. Choose a product which one can continue using even after the vendor collapses When you are offering Easysale POS or Mayo School ERP to customers, do you include the source code so that they can continue using/improving/modifying it should your company collapse?
I have zero experience in the field of making and selling software, thus my questions above may seem a bit obvious, so please, educate a brother :-) _______________________________________________ skunkworks mailing list skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke ------------ List info, subscribe/unsubscribe http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------
Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- ----------------------------------------- Regards King'ori.
Hi Mark, my company is working on a POS which is a drop in of a bigger application. You can deploy on premise or run in cloud. You can get the source if you want, but we offer an SLA to handle that, which is cheaper than you having a full-time dev screw up the code. So Mark, I will send you the details probably tomorrow and see if we can set you up with a demo. The basic version has all that you have asked for so far. Now Nicholas, I have to to jump in at this point and comment on some of your points 1. When you say PHP is easier than xxxx that's very subjective, that may be true for you and your peers. Maybe Mark has the resources who are experts in other languages. I certainly do have. Think about it. Besides, open source doesn't center around PHP. There's a lot I could argue on this, but not now. 2. Just so you know MariaDB was not started because of fear of Oracle killing MySQL it was started after Sun acquired MySQL. I personally got involved in MariaDB right from day one back in 2008 that is 6 years ago. Another thing, the latest MySQL 5.6 has the largest amount of feature additions and performance improvements of any previous MySQL version. I don't know if that constitutes killing it. The thing with Oracle is that they have their own twisted way of managing open source and that's what pisses off people. especially seeing the like of Oracel, Ms and Apple have historically not been know to be too keen on open source. 3. I agree with you on the source code. I have had a few customers ask for source code and not make much use of it. I think having source code just makes customers feel fuzzy and sleep better at night but when it comes down to it they always come back for new features from upstream. But all in all its always costly for customers to try to maintain source code themselves because they have to maintain full time devs, who have to be trained on the code. Then getting patches and bug fixes may break code that was added by the dev so they end up avoiding them. It just becomes a nightmare and this becomes part of the reason why today many companies are stuck on legacy systems/backward-compatibly issues. ----- Original Message ----- | From: "Kinpro Computers-All IT soutions" <kinprocomputers@gmail.com> | To: skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke | Sent: Sábado, 20 de Julio 2013 23:00:02 | Subject: Re: [Skunkworks] POS solution | | Hi Peter, | | 1.PHP is easy, not hidden and can easily be ported to higher versions | of Apache\PHP\mysql and immediately shoot,if logic and patterns are | not that complicated.Very few guys out there have added | obfuscations.PHP is the cheapest in terms of hosting in the clouds | and | locally. You will also find many guys who can read and write | something(edit) in PHP that Java. | | 2.MySQL was bought by Oracle so that they can pick better side while | killing it, it now moving fast to closed source sides,those guys die | hard Open Source evangelist have now moved to start Maria DB.Java was | almost crippled (Removing all useful APIs) if Google wasn't there to | save their soul as they have invested so much. Mysql is the most used | DB in the web and local apps by multi - billion corporates that could | by oracle products. | | 4.My Customers had never asked to buy the source- codes.By the way | that would cost them more in terms of initial cost and | maintenance.They will rarely , get a cheap programmer, they will | always find some problems when their in house programmer depart, new | one has to learn hard, we would find it very hard to add new features | when things have changed so much(incompatible).So far our customers | have tried to define what they need and we do add or modify very | quickly to an extent they they think they do`nt need any more support | support for the foreseeable future, with as stable as it would be the | customer would never need us until they change how they do | business,which means any software can get as far as that distance. | | By the way our software products are by far the | cheapest,customizable,scalable from the front side than many software | around.Any client that is that greedy to think of tempering with | code,might have chosen a wrong product. or have a wrong intentions.We | add,customize features by charging a very low amount of money than | any | proud programmer around.While people thing of outsourcing project | around the world others think of taking every slice in each layer to | themselves. | | By the way many outsource project are like "survey and free way to | use | others skills and ideas", and somewhere these guys would start to | pull | a string leaving others hanging.Do you want me to hurt you...?M-Pesa | was a good exploitation of bright minds in Kenya.Bright minds in | Kenya | contributed so much to Mpesa thing,they pushed from taking off, | diversified and finally someone would pull a string with patent | things.How should those guys be paid or benefit in terms of royalties | ? | | If you like source code you have two ways..by the product, or | outsource a task to us, or sub contract us..we would more than happy. | | Nicholas Peter Mmasi. | | >>>>>>>>>>>>>> | From: Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> | | Hi Nicholas, | I find your analysis of open source software quite interesting, | please | clarify the following points: | | 1. Never bother with non-PHP based open source apps | Why is this so? Why PHP? | | 2. Java and MySQL are owned by Oracle | Why is the ownership of these two by Oracle such as bad thing for | open | source software? | | 3. Choose a product which one can continue using even after the | vendor collapses | When you are offering Easysale POS or Mayo School ERP to customers, | do | you include the source code so that they can continue | using/improving/modifying it should your company collapse? | | I have zero experience in the field of making and selling software, | thus my questions above may seem a bit obvious, so please, educate a | brother :-) | _______________________________________________ | skunkworks mailing list | skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke | ------------ | List info, subscribe/unsubscribe | http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks | ------------ | | Skunkworks Rules | http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 | ------------ | Other services @ http://my.co.ke |
Hi Nicholas, more questions... 1. PHP is easy Do you suppose PHP being easy is as result of the education, experience and exposure of the developer? I would assume that there are several people on this list who would say that Python is way easier than PHP, while others would swear by C#. What do you think? 2. MySQL and Oracle So essentially Oracle bought Sun for $7.4 billion so that they can pick whats good in MySQL, add it to Oracle DB and then kill MySQL so as to force users of MySQL to start buying Oracle DB? Other than MariaDB, are there no other open source RDBMS out there that can make a viable replacement for MySQL? 4. Your customers and your code In your earlier email, you said: *Go for product that you can use longer even if the vendor collapse.*... My earlier question was, if I buy your software today and tomorrow your company collapses, and then the day after, I want some changes in the way it works, what options do I have considering that I don't have access to the code? On Sun, Jul 21, 2013 at 1:00 AM, Kinpro Computers-All IT soutions < kinprocomputers@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Peter,
1.PHP is easy, not hidden and can easily be ported to higher versions of Apache\PHP\mysql and immediately shoot,if logic and patterns are not that complicated.Very few guys out there have added obfuscations.PHP is the cheapest in terms of hosting in the clouds and locally. You will also find many guys who can read and write something(edit) in PHP that Java.
2.MySQL was bought by Oracle so that they can pick better side while killing it, it now moving fast to closed source sides,those guys die hard Open Source evangelist have now moved to start Maria DB.Java was almost crippled (Removing all useful APIs) if Google wasn't there to save their soul as they have invested so much. Mysql is the most used DB in the web and local apps by multi - billion corporates that could by oracle products.
4.My Customers had never asked to buy the source- codes.By the way that would cost them more in terms of initial cost and maintenance.They will rarely , get a cheap programmer, they will always find some problems when their in house programmer depart, new one has to learn hard, we would find it very hard to add new features when things have changed so much(incompatible).So far our customers have tried to define what they need and we do add or modify very quickly to an extent they they think they do`nt need any more support support for the foreseeable future, with as stable as it would be the customer would never need us until they change how they do business,which means any software can get as far as that distance.
By the way our software products are by far the cheapest,customizable,scalable from the front side than many software around.Any client that is that greedy to think of tempering with code,might have chosen a wrong product. or have a wrong intentions.We add,customize features by charging a very low amount of money than any proud programmer around.While people thing of outsourcing project around the world others think of taking every slice in each layer to themselves.
By the way many outsource project are like "survey and free way to use others skills and ideas", and somewhere these guys would start to pull a string leaving others hanging.Do you want me to hurt you...?M-Pesa was a good exploitation of bright minds in Kenya.Bright minds in Kenya contributed so much to Mpesa thing,they pushed from taking off, diversified and finally someone would pull a string with patent things.How should those guys be paid or benefit in terms of royalties ?
If you like source code you have two ways..by the product, or outsource a task to us, or sub contract us..we would more than happy.
Nicholas Peter Mmasi.
>>>>>>>>> From: Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com>
Hi Nicholas, I find your analysis of open source software quite interesting, please clarify the following points:
1. Never bother with non-PHP based open source apps Why is this so? Why PHP?
2. Java and MySQL are owned by Oracle Why is the ownership of these two by Oracle such as bad thing for open source software?
3. Choose a product which one can continue using even after the vendor collapses When you are offering Easysale POS or Mayo School ERP to customers, do you include the source code so that they can continue using/improving/modifying it should your company collapse?
I have zero experience in the field of making and selling software, thus my questions above may seem a bit obvious, so please, educate a brother :-) _______________________________________________ skunkworks mailing list skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke ------------ List info, subscribe/unsubscribe http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------
Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Regards, Peter Karunyu -------------------
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ ︵ ╯(°□° ╯) On 21 July 2013 10:08, Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Nicholas, more questions...
1. PHP is easy Do you suppose PHP being easy is as result of the education, experience and exposure of the developer? I would assume that there are several people on this list who would say that Python is way easier than PHP, while others would swear by C#. What do you think?
2. MySQL and Oracle So essentially Oracle bought Sun for $7.4 billion so that they can pick whats good in MySQL, add it to Oracle DB and then kill MySQL so as to force users of MySQL to start buying Oracle DB?
Other than MariaDB, are there no other open source RDBMS out there that can make a viable replacement for MySQL?
4. Your customers and your code In your earlier email, you said: *Go for product that you can use longer even if the vendor collapse.*...
My earlier question was, if I buy your software today and tomorrow your company collapses, and then the day after, I want some changes in the way it works, what options do I have considering that I don't have access to the code?
On Sun, Jul 21, 2013 at 1:00 AM, Kinpro Computers-All IT soutions < kinprocomputers@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Peter,
1.PHP is easy, not hidden and can easily be ported to higher versions of Apache\PHP\mysql and immediately shoot,if logic and patterns are not that complicated.Very few guys out there have added obfuscations.PHP is the cheapest in terms of hosting in the clouds and locally. You will also find many guys who can read and write something(edit) in PHP that Java.
2.MySQL was bought by Oracle so that they can pick better side while killing it, it now moving fast to closed source sides,those guys die hard Open Source evangelist have now moved to start Maria DB.Java was almost crippled (Removing all useful APIs) if Google wasn't there to save their soul as they have invested so much. Mysql is the most used DB in the web and local apps by multi - billion corporates that could by oracle products.
4.My Customers had never asked to buy the source- codes.By the way that would cost them more in terms of initial cost and maintenance.They will rarely , get a cheap programmer, they will always find some problems when their in house programmer depart, new one has to learn hard, we would find it very hard to add new features when things have changed so much(incompatible).So far our customers have tried to define what they need and we do add or modify very quickly to an extent they they think they do`nt need any more support support for the foreseeable future, with as stable as it would be the customer would never need us until they change how they do business,which means any software can get as far as that distance.
By the way our software products are by far the cheapest,customizable,scalable from the front side than many software around.Any client that is that greedy to think of tempering with code,might have chosen a wrong product. or have a wrong intentions.We add,customize features by charging a very low amount of money than any proud programmer around.While people thing of outsourcing project around the world others think of taking every slice in each layer to themselves.
By the way many outsource project are like "survey and free way to use others skills and ideas", and somewhere these guys would start to pull a string leaving others hanging.Do you want me to hurt you...?M-Pesa was a good exploitation of bright minds in Kenya.Bright minds in Kenya contributed so much to Mpesa thing,they pushed from taking off, diversified and finally someone would pull a string with patent things.How should those guys be paid or benefit in terms of royalties ?
If you like source code you have two ways..by the product, or outsource a task to us, or sub contract us..we would more than happy.
Nicholas Peter Mmasi.
>>>>>>>>>> From: Peter Karunyu <pkarunyu@gmail.com>
Hi Nicholas, I find your analysis of open source software quite interesting, please clarify the following points:
1. Never bother with non-PHP based open source apps Why is this so? Why PHP?
2. Java and MySQL are owned by Oracle Why is the ownership of these two by Oracle such as bad thing for open source software?
3. Choose a product which one can continue using even after the vendor collapses When you are offering Easysale POS or Mayo School ERP to customers, do you include the source code so that they can continue using/improving/modifying it should your company collapse?
I have zero experience in the field of making and selling software, thus my questions above may seem a bit obvious, so please, educate a brother :-) _______________________________________________ skunkworks mailing list skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke ------------ List info, subscribe/unsubscribe http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------
Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- Regards, Peter Karunyu -------------------
_______________________________________________ skunkworks mailing list skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke ------------ List info, subscribe/unsubscribe http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks ------------
Skunkworks Rules http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 ------------ Other services @ http://my.co.ke
-- ----------------------------------------- Regards King'ori.
participants (4)
-
Keneth Kingori -
Kinpro Computers-All IT soutions -
Peter Karunyu -
Steve Obbayi