Hello All. Asking all Network Engineers especially in the Wireless Field.
From my observations in most places,eg restaurants,coffee shops etc,most of the Access Points in use are 2.4GHz AP.Now we can all agree that 2.4Ghz spectrum is usually fully congested,hence sometimes even the experience becomes bad for people. I see most establishments are either using TP-Links,Ubiquiti Nanostations or Unifi and others rely on the ISP provided router. An equipment like Unifi tends to start degrading after reaching around 40 users. Now with the way the trend is going,most devices are now even coming with dual band chipsets eg iphones and the like.
My question to the forum is. 1) Why don't establishments want to put dual-band APs? 2) is their a good dual-band AP that somebody can recommend? I know equipments like Ruckus and Xirrus can get the job done..but we all know that few companies will cough up large amounts of cash for just an AP. what are your thoughts? Regards Cynthia.
Cynthia You already said it PRICE ! Cheap is expensive :-) Regards, On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 3:37 PM, Cynthia Wahome via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Hello All. Asking all Network Engineers especially in the Wireless Field.
From my observations in most places,eg restaurants,coffee shops etc,most of the Access Points in use are 2.4GHz AP.Now we can all agree that 2.4Ghz spectrum is usually fully congested,hence sometimes even the experience becomes bad for people. I see most establishments are either using TP-Links,Ubiquiti Nanostations or Unifi and others rely on the ISP provided router. An equipment like Unifi tends to start degrading after reaching around 40 users. Now with the way the trend is going,most devices are now even coming with dual band chipsets eg iphones and the like.
My question to the forum is.
1) Why don't establishments want to put dual-band APs? 2) is their a good dual-band AP that somebody can recommend?
I know equipments like Ruckus and Xirrus can get the job done..but we all know that few companies will cough up large amounts of cash for just an AP.
what are your thoughts?
Regards Cynthia.
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Agreed Alvin. Price plays a factor..but are you telling me that their is no establishment which is willing to even spend say 35k on a good dual band AP but have peace of mind? :-) Or maybe is it also us engineers who recommend the devices just to get the business.....hmmmmmmm Regards Cynthia
Cynthia
You already said it PRICE !
Cheap is expensive :-)
Regards,
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 3:37 PM, Cynthia Wahome via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Hello All. Asking all Network Engineers especially in the Wireless Field.
From my observations in most places,eg restaurants,coffee shops etc,most of the Access Points in use are 2.4GHz AP.Now we can all agree that 2.4Ghz spectrum is usually fully congested,hence sometimes even the experience becomes bad for people. I see most establishments are either using TP-Links,Ubiquiti Nanostations or Unifi and others rely on the ISP provided router. An equipment like Unifi tends to start degrading after reaching around 40 users. Now with the way the trend is going,most devices are now even coming with dual band chipsets eg iphones and the like.
My question to the forum is.
1) Why don't establishments want to put dual-band APs? 2) is their a good dual-band AP that somebody can recommend?
I know equipments like Ruckus and Xirrus can get the job done..but we all know that few companies will cough up large amounts of cash for just an AP.
what are your thoughts?
Regards Cynthia.
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-- ALVIN OCHOLA 0722-313923 www.greenline.co.ke
also, user device capability... most (if not all) devices with WiFi capability support 2.4Ghz... 5GHz on user devices is a relative newcomer... the extra cost is not worth it... case in point - at a restaurant i support, the 2.4GHz will have ~25users while 5GHz will have 3 users at most... -- On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 3:44 PM, Alvin Ochola via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Cynthia
You already said it PRICE !
Cheap is expensive :-)
Regards,
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 3:37 PM, Cynthia Wahome via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Hello All. Asking all Network Engineers especially in the Wireless Field.
From my observations in most places,eg restaurants,coffee shops etc,most of the Access Points in use are 2.4GHz AP.Now we can all agree that 2.4Ghz spectrum is usually fully congested,hence sometimes even the experience becomes bad for people. I see most establishments are either using TP-Links,Ubiquiti Nanostations or Unifi and others rely on the ISP provided router. An equipment like Unifi tends to start degrading after reaching around 40 users. Now with the way the trend is going,most devices are now even coming with dual band chipsets eg iphones and the like.
My question to the forum is.
1) Why don't establishments want to put dual-band APs? 2) is their a good dual-band AP that somebody can recommend?
I know equipments like Ruckus and Xirrus can get the job done..but we all know that few companies will cough up large amounts of cash for just an AP.
what are your thoughts?
Regards Cynthia.
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-- ALVIN OCHOLA 0722-313923 www.greenline.co.ke
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Hi Cynthia, In my experience you find that the deployment is insufficient to cater to the needs of the establishment/organization because either; - the initial requirements were not captured sufficiently, - the wrong solution was provided, - the network has been outgrown by the business and requires a re-assessment, - poorly done installation or support cycles or - when cost compromises the technical requirements. To try answer your 2 questions 1. Dual-band are more costly e.g UBNT LR(Single-Band 12-14k range), UBNT PRO (Dual-Band 35k-42k range) 2. Do some background reading here <http://www.enterprisenetworkingplanet.com/netsysm/article.php/3924291/Buyers-Guide-to-Enterprise-WLAN-Controllers.htm> and here <http://searchnetworking.techtarget.com/buyersguide/Wireless-LAN-technology-A-buyers-guide> . R D On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 3:44 PM, Alvin Ochola via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Cynthia
You already said it PRICE !
Cheap is expensive :-)
Regards,
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 3:37 PM, Cynthia Wahome via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Hello All. Asking all Network Engineers especially in the Wireless Field.
From my observations in most places,eg restaurants,coffee shops etc,most of the Access Points in use are 2.4GHz AP.Now we can all agree that 2.4Ghz spectrum is usually fully congested,hence sometimes even the experience becomes bad for people. I see most establishments are either using TP-Links,Ubiquiti Nanostations or Unifi and others rely on the ISP provided router. An equipment like Unifi tends to start degrading after reaching around 40 users. Now with the way the trend is going,most devices are now even coming with dual band chipsets eg iphones and the like.
My question to the forum is.
1) Why don't establishments want to put dual-band APs? 2) is their a good dual-band AP that somebody can recommend?
I know equipments like Ruckus and Xirrus can get the job done..but we all know that few companies will cough up large amounts of cash for just an AP.
what are your thoughts?
Regards Cynthia.
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-- ALVIN OCHOLA 0722-313923 www.greenline.co.ke
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Just to echo your point, a good design MUST be done based on the deployment environment(indoor/outdoor, interference, number of concurrent users - sometimes even DHCP scope) etc. In addition also the deployment done and monitoring. When a network isn't performing well during peak hours and monitoring is done well, the access problems can be identified and rectified. Even the cheap access points can be designed and deployed in a way that they work as the organization grows. Kennedy On 19 Sep 2016 16:12, "Denis G. Wahome via skunkworks" < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Hi Cynthia,
In my experience you find that the deployment is insufficient to cater to the needs of the establishment/organization because either;
- the initial requirements were not captured sufficiently, - the wrong solution was provided, - the network has been outgrown by the business and requires a re-assessment, - poorly done installation or support cycles or - when cost compromises the technical requirements.
To try answer your 2 questions
1. Dual-band are more costly e.g UBNT LR(Single-Band 12-14k range), UBNT PRO (Dual-Band 35k-42k range)
2. Do some background reading here <http://www.enterprisenetworkingplanet.com/netsysm/article.php/3924291/Buyers-Guide-to-Enterprise-WLAN-Controllers.htm> and here <http://searchnetworking.techtarget.com/buyersguide/Wireless-LAN-technology-A-buyers-guide> .
R
D
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 3:44 PM, Alvin Ochola via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Cynthia
You already said it PRICE !
Cheap is expensive :-)
Regards,
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 3:37 PM, Cynthia Wahome via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Hello All. Asking all Network Engineers especially in the Wireless Field.
From my observations in most places,eg restaurants,coffee shops etc,most of the Access Points in use are 2.4GHz AP.Now we can all agree that 2.4Ghz spectrum is usually fully congested,hence sometimes even the experience becomes bad for people. I see most establishments are either using TP-Links,Ubiquiti Nanostations or Unifi and others rely on the ISP provided router. An equipment like Unifi tends to start degrading after reaching around 40 users. Now with the way the trend is going,most devices are now even coming with dual band chipsets eg iphones and the like.
My question to the forum is.
1) Why don't establishments want to put dual-band APs? 2) is their a good dual-band AP that somebody can recommend?
I know equipments like Ruckus and Xirrus can get the job done..but we all know that few companies will cough up large amounts of cash for just an AP.
what are your thoughts?
Regards Cynthia.
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-- ALVIN OCHOLA 0722-313923 www.greenline.co.ke
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+ 1 Kennedy Regards On 9/19/16, Kennedy Aseda via skunkworks <skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Just to echo your point, a good design MUST be done based on the deployment environment(indoor/outdoor, interference, number of concurrent users - sometimes even DHCP scope) etc. In addition also the deployment done and monitoring.
When a network isn't performing well during peak hours and monitoring is done well, the access problems can be identified and rectified. Even the cheap access points can be designed and deployed in a way that they work as the organization grows.
Kennedy
On 19 Sep 2016 16:12, "Denis G. Wahome via skunkworks" < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Hi Cynthia,
In my experience you find that the deployment is insufficient to cater to the needs of the establishment/organization because either;
- the initial requirements were not captured sufficiently, - the wrong solution was provided, - the network has been outgrown by the business and requires a re-assessment, - poorly done installation or support cycles or - when cost compromises the technical requirements.
To try answer your 2 questions
1. Dual-band are more costly e.g UBNT LR(Single-Band 12-14k range), UBNT PRO (Dual-Band 35k-42k range)
2. Do some background reading here <http://www.enterprisenetworkingplanet.com/netsysm/article.php/3924291/Buyers-Guide-to-Enterprise-WLAN-Controllers.htm> and here <http://searchnetworking.techtarget.com/buyersguide/Wireless-LAN-technology-A-buyers-guide> .
R
D
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 3:44 PM, Alvin Ochola via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Cynthia
You already said it PRICE !
Cheap is expensive :-)
Regards,
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 3:37 PM, Cynthia Wahome via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Hello All. Asking all Network Engineers especially in the Wireless Field.
From my observations in most places,eg restaurants,coffee shops etc,most of the Access Points in use are 2.4GHz AP.Now we can all agree that 2.4Ghz spectrum is usually fully congested,hence sometimes even the experience becomes bad for people. I see most establishments are either using TP-Links,Ubiquiti Nanostations or Unifi and others rely on the ISP provided router. An equipment like Unifi tends to start degrading after reaching around 40 users. Now with the way the trend is going,most devices are now even coming with dual band chipsets eg iphones and the like.
My question to the forum is.
1) Why don't establishments want to put dual-band APs? 2) is their a good dual-band AP that somebody can recommend?
I know equipments like Ruckus and Xirrus can get the job done..but we all know that few companies will cough up large amounts of cash for just an AP.
what are your thoughts?
Regards Cynthia.
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-- ALVIN OCHOLA 0722-313923 www.greenline.co.ke
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-- Barrack O. Otieno +254721325277 +254733206359 Skype: barrack.otieno PGP ID: 0x2611D86A
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Barrack Otieno via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
+ 1 Kennedy
+1. In addition. There are good AP's out there. Question is implementation. Most devices have 2.4 radios and often enough only the more fancier/expensive devices have both both. The skill is understanding how 2.4Ghz behaves in room and what happens when you have very many other 2.4Ghz radios in the same room. So think about it this way. If you have someone standing on a table in the middle of the room full of 30 people. Then the person tries speak and everyone starts talking back what happens ?. The more people there are and they all want to be heard, they will raise their voices and this tends to make things worse - not better. Now imagine in the same room, if you have 3 people strategically placed to speak in a measured voice/tone that covers just about the radius that seats 10 people. You are more likely to have a better experience when speaking to 10 people and hearing them back compared to when one person speaks to 30 and hopes to hear all of them. So having 3 cheap AP's well configured (low power, non-overlapping channels on 2.4) and strategically placed in the room can yield a much better performance in such an environment compared to having a single high end AP that can support over 70 simultaneous sessions. But there is no harm in getting the high end AP's but also configure them as they should. We have far too much and often unnecessary noise in any given building/location in Nairobi on the 2.4Ghz range. I just wish folks paid more attention when configuring the APs and realize that high power is not equal to better performance or speed. It reminds me that the other day, I was at place that forced my laptop radio to automatically shutdown. Reason being that the facility had an indoor AP broadcasting using a 26 dBm antennae and may laptop OS did not like that at all. HTH. Regards, Michuki.
to be honest as a reseller of AP's most clients dont know the difference and only buy as directed by installers. So its either the installers doing a shoddy job or are unqualified to do good quality installations but from experience most of building owners who are up to having wi-fi in their buildings are actually ready and willing to pay Regards On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 12:20 PM, Michuki Mwangi via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Barrack Otieno via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
+ 1 Kennedy
+1.
In addition. There are good AP's out there. Question is implementation.
Most devices have 2.4 radios and often enough only the more fancier/expensive devices have both both.
The skill is understanding how 2.4Ghz behaves in room and what happens when you have very many other 2.4Ghz radios in the same room. So think about it this way. If you have someone standing on a table in the middle of the room full of 30 people. Then the person tries speak and everyone starts talking back what happens ?. The more people there are and they all want to be heard, they will raise their voices and this tends to make things worse - not better.
Now imagine in the same room, if you have 3 people strategically placed to speak in a measured voice/tone that covers just about the radius that seats 10 people.
You are more likely to have a better experience when speaking to 10 people and hearing them back compared to when one person speaks to 30 and hopes to hear all of them.
So having 3 cheap AP's well configured (low power, non-overlapping channels on 2.4) and strategically placed in the room can yield a much better performance in such an environment compared to having a single high end AP that can support over 70 simultaneous sessions.
But there is no harm in getting the high end AP's but also configure them as they should. We have far too much and often unnecessary noise in any given building/location in Nairobi on the 2.4Ghz range. I just wish folks paid more attention when configuring the APs and realize that high power is not equal to better performance or speed. It reminds me that the other day, I was at place that forced my laptop radio to automatically shutdown. Reason being that the facility had an indoor AP broadcasting using a 26 dBm antennae and may laptop OS did not like that at all.
HTH.
Regards,
Michuki.
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Peter + 1 On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 9:13 AM, Peter Munge via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
to be honest as a reseller of AP's most clients dont know the difference and only buy as directed by installers. So its either the installers doing a shoddy job or are unqualified to do good quality installations but from experience most of building owners who are up to having wi-fi in their buildings are actually ready and willing to pay
Regards
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 12:20 PM, Michuki Mwangi via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Barrack Otieno via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
+ 1 Kennedy
+1.
In addition. There are good AP's out there. Question is implementation.
Most devices have 2.4 radios and often enough only the more fancier/expensive devices have both both.
The skill is understanding how 2.4Ghz behaves in room and what happens when you have very many other 2.4Ghz radios in the same room. So think about it this way. If you have someone standing on a table in the middle of the room full of 30 people. Then the person tries speak and everyone starts talking back what happens ?. The more people there are and they all want to be heard, they will raise their voices and this tends to make things worse - not better.
Now imagine in the same room, if you have 3 people strategically placed to speak in a measured voice/tone that covers just about the radius that seats 10 people.
You are more likely to have a better experience when speaking to 10 people and hearing them back compared to when one person speaks to 30 and hopes to hear all of them.
So having 3 cheap AP's well configured (low power, non-overlapping channels on 2.4) and strategically placed in the room can yield a much better performance in such an environment compared to having a single high end AP that can support over 70 simultaneous sessions.
But there is no harm in getting the high end AP's but also configure them as they should. We have far too much and often unnecessary noise in any given building/location in Nairobi on the 2.4Ghz range. I just wish folks paid more attention when configuring the APs and realize that high power is not equal to better performance or speed. It reminds me that the other day, I was at place that forced my laptop radio to automatically shutdown. Reason being that the facility had an indoor AP broadcasting using a 26 dBm antennae and may laptop OS did not like that at all.
HTH.
Regards,
Michuki.
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Cisco APs as well are dual band. Kind regards, Caroline Mwangi. On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 9:20 AM, Alvin Ochola via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Peter + 1
On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 9:13 AM, Peter Munge via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
to be honest as a reseller of AP's most clients dont know the difference and only buy as directed by installers. So its either the installers doing a shoddy job or are unqualified to do good quality installations but from experience most of building owners who are up to having wi-fi in their buildings are actually ready and willing to pay
Regards
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 12:20 PM, Michuki Mwangi via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Barrack Otieno via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
+ 1 Kennedy
+1.
In addition. There are good AP's out there. Question is implementation.
Most devices have 2.4 radios and often enough only the more fancier/expensive devices have both both.
The skill is understanding how 2.4Ghz behaves in room and what happens when you have very many other 2.4Ghz radios in the same room. So think about it this way. If you have someone standing on a table in the middle of the room full of 30 people. Then the person tries speak and everyone starts talking back what happens ?. The more people there are and they all want to be heard, they will raise their voices and this tends to make things worse - not better.
Now imagine in the same room, if you have 3 people strategically placed to speak in a measured voice/tone that covers just about the radius that seats 10 people.
You are more likely to have a better experience when speaking to 10 people and hearing them back compared to when one person speaks to 30 and hopes to hear all of them.
So having 3 cheap AP's well configured (low power, non-overlapping channels on 2.4) and strategically placed in the room can yield a much better performance in such an environment compared to having a single high end AP that can support over 70 simultaneous sessions.
But there is no harm in getting the high end AP's but also configure them as they should. We have far too much and often unnecessary noise in any given building/location in Nairobi on the 2.4Ghz range. I just wish folks paid more attention when configuring the APs and realize that high power is not equal to better performance or speed. It reminds me that the other day, I was at place that forced my laptop radio to automatically shutdown. Reason being that the facility had an indoor AP broadcasting using a 26 dBm antennae and may laptop OS did not like that at all.
HTH.
Regards,
Michuki.
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The main problem we have in Kenya is that most installers and clients don't take WIFI seriously. As long as a client can see the WIFI signal on his device he insists he is good to go. How many installers for example have the proper WIFI survey tools to start with? On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 1:41 PM, Caroline Mwangi via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Cisco APs as well are dual band.
Kind regards, Caroline Mwangi.
On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 9:20 AM, Alvin Ochola via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Peter + 1
On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 9:13 AM, Peter Munge via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
to be honest as a reseller of AP's most clients dont know the difference and only buy as directed by installers. So its either the installers doing a shoddy job or are unqualified to do good quality installations but from experience most of building owners who are up to having wi-fi in their buildings are actually ready and willing to pay
Regards
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 12:20 PM, Michuki Mwangi via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Barrack Otieno via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
+ 1 Kennedy
+1.
In addition. There are good AP's out there. Question is implementation.
Most devices have 2.4 radios and often enough only the more fancier/expensive devices have both both.
The skill is understanding how 2.4Ghz behaves in room and what happens when you have very many other 2.4Ghz radios in the same room. So think about it this way. If you have someone standing on a table in the middle of the room full of 30 people. Then the person tries speak and everyone starts talking back what happens ?. The more people there are and they all want to be heard, they will raise their voices and this tends to make things worse - not better.
Now imagine in the same room, if you have 3 people strategically placed to speak in a measured voice/tone that covers just about the radius that seats 10 people.
You are more likely to have a better experience when speaking to 10 people and hearing them back compared to when one person speaks to 30 and hopes to hear all of them.
So having 3 cheap AP's well configured (low power, non-overlapping channels on 2.4) and strategically placed in the room can yield a much better performance in such an environment compared to having a single high end AP that can support over 70 simultaneous sessions.
But there is no harm in getting the high end AP's but also configure them as they should. We have far too much and often unnecessary noise in any given building/location in Nairobi on the 2.4Ghz range. I just wish folks paid more attention when configuring the APs and realize that high power is not equal to better performance or speed. It reminds me that the other day, I was at place that forced my laptop radio to automatically shutdown. Reason being that the facility had an indoor AP broadcasting using a 26 dBm antennae and may laptop OS did not like that at all.
HTH.
Regards,
Michuki.
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-- ALVIN OCHOLA 0722-313923 www.greenline.co.ke
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-- Regards, C . K
+1 kungu Reminds me of a project i had to re-scope because someone had sold over 25 APs supporting only 2.4Ghz for a mall!! Meraki saved the day though. Regards. On 20 September 2016 at 14:10, charles kungu via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
The main problem we have in Kenya is that most installers and clients don't take WIFI seriously. As long as a client can see the WIFI signal on his device he insists he is good to go. How many installers for example have the proper WIFI survey tools to start with?
On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 1:41 PM, Caroline Mwangi via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Cisco APs as well are dual band.
Kind regards, Caroline Mwangi.
On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 9:20 AM, Alvin Ochola via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Peter + 1
On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 9:13 AM, Peter Munge via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
to be honest as a reseller of AP's most clients dont know the difference and only buy as directed by installers. So its either the installers doing a shoddy job or are unqualified to do good quality installations but from experience most of building owners who are up to having wi-fi in their buildings are actually ready and willing to pay
Regards
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 12:20 PM, Michuki Mwangi via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Barrack Otieno via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
+ 1 Kennedy
+1.
In addition. There are good AP's out there. Question is implementation.
Most devices have 2.4 radios and often enough only the more fancier/expensive devices have both both.
The skill is understanding how 2.4Ghz behaves in room and what happens when you have very many other 2.4Ghz radios in the same room. So think about it this way. If you have someone standing on a table in the middle of the room full of 30 people. Then the person tries speak and everyone starts talking back what happens ?. The more people there are and they all want to be heard, they will raise their voices and this tends to make things worse - not better.
Now imagine in the same room, if you have 3 people strategically placed to speak in a measured voice/tone that covers just about the radius that seats 10 people.
You are more likely to have a better experience when speaking to 10 people and hearing them back compared to when one person speaks to 30 and hopes to hear all of them.
So having 3 cheap AP's well configured (low power, non-overlapping channels on 2.4) and strategically placed in the room can yield a much better performance in such an environment compared to having a single high end AP that can support over 70 simultaneous sessions.
But there is no harm in getting the high end AP's but also configure them as they should. We have far too much and often unnecessary noise in any given building/location in Nairobi on the 2.4Ghz range. I just wish folks paid more attention when configuring the APs and realize that high power is not equal to better performance or speed. It reminds me that the other day, I was at place that forced my laptop radio to automatically shutdown. Reason being that the facility had an indoor AP broadcasting using a 26 dBm antennae and may laptop OS did not like that at all.
HTH.
Regards,
Michuki.
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-- ALVIN OCHOLA 0722-313923 www.greenline.co.ke
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-- Regards, C . K
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THIS. THIS. THIS. -- On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 2:10 PM, charles kungu via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
The main problem we have in Kenya is that most installers and clients don't take WIFI seriously. As long as a client can see the WIFI signal on his device he insists he is good to go. How many installers for example have the proper WIFI survey tools to start with?
On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 1:41 PM, Caroline Mwangi via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Cisco APs as well are dual band.
Kind regards, Caroline Mwangi.
On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 9:20 AM, Alvin Ochola via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Peter + 1
On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 9:13 AM, Peter Munge via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
to be honest as a reseller of AP's most clients dont know the difference and only buy as directed by installers. So its either the installers doing a shoddy job or are unqualified to do good quality installations but from experience most of building owners who are up to having wi-fi in their buildings are actually ready and willing to pay
Regards
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 12:20 PM, Michuki Mwangi via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Barrack Otieno via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
+ 1 Kennedy
+1.
In addition. There are good AP's out there. Question is implementation.
Most devices have 2.4 radios and often enough only the more fancier/expensive devices have both both.
The skill is understanding how 2.4Ghz behaves in room and what happens when you have very many other 2.4Ghz radios in the same room. So think about it this way. If you have someone standing on a table in the middle of the room full of 30 people. Then the person tries speak and everyone starts talking back what happens ?. The more people there are and they all want to be heard, they will raise their voices and this tends to make things worse - not better.
Now imagine in the same room, if you have 3 people strategically placed to speak in a measured voice/tone that covers just about the radius that seats 10 people.
You are more likely to have a better experience when speaking to 10 people and hearing them back compared to when one person speaks to 30 and hopes to hear all of them.
So having 3 cheap AP's well configured (low power, non-overlapping channels on 2.4) and strategically placed in the room can yield a much better performance in such an environment compared to having a single high end AP that can support over 70 simultaneous sessions.
But there is no harm in getting the high end AP's but also configure them as they should. We have far too much and often unnecessary noise in any given building/location in Nairobi on the 2.4Ghz range. I just wish folks paid more attention when configuring the APs and realize that high power is not equal to better performance or speed. It reminds me that the other day, I was at place that forced my laptop radio to automatically shutdown. Reason being that the facility had an indoor AP broadcasting using a 26 dBm antennae and may laptop OS did not like that at all.
HTH.
Regards,
Michuki.
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-- ALVIN OCHOLA 0722-313923 www.greenline.co.ke
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-- Regards, C . K
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Interesting analogy. +1 On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 10:20 PM, Michuki Mwangi via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
In addition. There are good AP's out there. Question is implementation.
Most devices have 2.4 radios and often enough only the more fancier/expensive devices have both both.
The skill is understanding how 2.4Ghz behaves in room and what happens when you have very many other 2.4Ghz radios in the same room. So think about it this way. If you have someone standing on a table in the middle of the room full of 30 people. Then the person tries speak and everyone starts talking back what happens ?. The more people there are and they all want to be heard, they will raise their voices and this tends to make things worse - not better.
Now imagine in the same room, if you have 3 people strategically placed to speak in a measured voice/tone that covers just about the radius that seats 10 people.
You are more likely to have a better experience when speaking to 10 people and hearing them back compared to when one person speaks to 30 and hopes to hear all of them.
So having 3 cheap AP's well configured (low power, non-overlapping channels on 2.4) and strategically placed in the room can yield a much better performance in such an environment compared to having a single high end AP that can support over 70 simultaneous sessions.
But there is no harm in getting the high end AP's but also configure them as they should. We have far too much and often unnecessary noise in any given building/location in Nairobi on the 2.4Ghz range. I just wish folks paid more attention when configuring the APs and realize that high power is not equal to better performance or speed. It reminds me that the other day, I was at place that forced my laptop radio to automatically shutdown. Reason being that the facility had an indoor AP broadcasting using a 26 dBm antennae and may laptop OS did not like that at all.
HTH.
Regards,
Michuki.
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let me digress abit, Out of curiosity from the installers in this forum, how many clients are usually interested in knowing what their clients are doing and who they are? On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 10:11 AM, Patrick Kariuki via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Interesting analogy. +1
On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 10:20 PM, Michuki Mwangi via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
In addition. There are good AP's out there. Question is implementation.
Most devices have 2.4 radios and often enough only the more fancier/expensive devices have both both.
The skill is understanding how 2.4Ghz behaves in room and what happens when you have very many other 2.4Ghz radios in the same room. So think about it this way. If you have someone standing on a table in the middle of the room full of 30 people. Then the person tries speak and everyone starts talking back what happens ?. The more people there are and they all want to be heard, they will raise their voices and this tends to make things worse - not better.
Now imagine in the same room, if you have 3 people strategically placed to speak in a measured voice/tone that covers just about the radius that seats 10 people.
You are more likely to have a better experience when speaking to 10 people and hearing them back compared to when one person speaks to 30 and hopes to hear all of them.
So having 3 cheap AP's well configured (low power, non-overlapping channels on 2.4) and strategically placed in the room can yield a much better performance in such an environment compared to having a single high end AP that can support over 70 simultaneous sessions.
But there is no harm in getting the high end AP's but also configure them as they should. We have far too much and often unnecessary noise in any given building/location in Nairobi on the 2.4Ghz range. I just wish folks paid more attention when configuring the APs and realize that high power is not equal to better performance or speed. It reminds me that the other day, I was at place that forced my laptop radio to automatically shutdown. Reason being that the facility had an indoor AP broadcasting using a 26 dBm antennae and may laptop OS did not like that at all.
HTH.
Regards,
Michuki.
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Cynthia, After your preamble, I am tempted to ask why you posed your question #2 On 19 September 2016 at 15:37, Cynthia Wahome via skunkworks < skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke> wrote:
Hello All. Asking all Network Engineers especially in the Wireless Field.
From my observations in most places,eg restaurants,coffee shops etc,most of the Access Points in use are 2.4GHz AP.Now we can all agree that 2.4Ghz spectrum is usually fully congested,hence sometimes even the experience becomes bad for people. I see most establishments are either using TP-Links,Ubiquiti Nanostations or Unifi and others rely on the ISP provided router. An equipment like Unifi tends to start degrading after reaching around 40 users. Now with the way the trend is going,most devices are now even coming with dual band chipsets eg iphones and the like.
My question to the forum is.
1) Why don't establishments want to put dual-band APs? 2) is their a good dual-band AP that somebody can recommend?
I know equipments like Ruckus and Xirrus can get the job done..but we all know that few companies will cough up large amounts of cash for just an AP.
what are your thoughts?
Regards Cynthia.
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-- Best regards, Odhiambo WASHINGTON, Nairobi,KE +254 7 3200 0004/+254 7 2274 3223 "Oh, the cruft."
participants (14)
-
Alvin Ochola -
Barrack Otieno -
Caroline Mwangi -
charles kungu -
Cynthia Wahome -
Denis G. Wahome -
Francis Nderitu -
Kennedy Aseda -
Michuki Mwangi -
MotoBaridi -
Odhiambo Washington -
Patrick Kariuki -
Peter Munge -
William Magachi