I find this debate rather unnecessary. Let us assume that this is a faith based organisation say a church or a christian NGO. Why would a worshiper from some other religion want to apply here? I imagine that is what the requirement is supposed to sieve. If I was a devout Muslim, qualified and got called for an interview only to find its an evangelical christian NGO that was hiring, I would feel uncomfortable and would probably not take the job. And don't give me hypothetical situations that a devout Muslim would somehow be very comfortable working at a christian church. What about those jobs that require one to be a Kenyan citizen eg the Kenya police, military? Are they discriminatory against Belgians and Ugandans? On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 9:25 PM, joe mwirigi <joemwirigi@gmail.com> wrote:
This world is founded on discriminations only that they find "better words" to use save the word *discrimination* e.g preference. If you are looking for a web programmer, you are discriminating against the food scientist who is also looking for a job!. If you are looking for a degree holder, u r disciminating against that turkana man who could not afford to go to school but has the heart to do 'websites' for u!. The discriminative word in the foregoing being"qualifications". All what law does is to create a list of allowable discriminations or detrmine what discrimination is or is not! If am looking for a christian / muslim, I need just that because am not the government. I guess if u want affirmative action to be followed, do that for government jobs where its a tarry-list of sexes, tribes, papers and others as may be added by lobbyists, civil societies, human rights and the never ending array of NGOs who source their food from such balances, fractions and numbers. :) let me just laugh it off anyway
*_______________________________________________________________ We must Keep on, *
On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 4:45 PM, John Doe <fivepings@gmail.com> wrote:
@ Gad, it can be done....so can changing your religion. I guess this debate has just made me ask some questions...what really is discrimination? And can it be changed?
Is affirmative action as applied by SA for blacks or by Kenya for Women discriminative against whites and Men?
On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 4:34 PM, James Nzomo <kazikubwa@gmail.com> wrote:
Employment Act 2007,
Part II - General Principles, 5.
(3) No employer shall discriminate directly or indirectly, against an employee or prospective employee or harass an employee or *prospective employee* -- (a) on grounds of race, colour, sex, language, *religion*, political or *other opinion*, *nationality*, ethnic or social origin, disability, pregnancy,* mental status *or HIV status;
This begs the question.... *"what exactly is meant by Discrimination?"* or rather ..*What did they mean by descrimination?*
_______________________________________________
*Without requirements or design, programming is the art of adding bugs to an empty text file.* _______________________________________________ *
*
2012/1/25 John Doe <fivepings@gmail.com>
Would it make a difference if the advertisement said Christian faith would be an added advantage?
When a job requires 5 years experience, isn't it 'discriminating' against those with 4 years experience?
Some interesting debate going on here.....
On Wed, Jan 25, 2012 at 6:28 AM, Mutwiri Kiogora <mutwirik@gmail.com>wrote:
Employment Act 2007,
Part II - General Principles, 5.
(3) No employer shall discriminate directly or indirectly, against an employee or prospective employee or harass an employee or *prospective employee* -- (a) on grounds of race, colour, sex, language, *religion*, political or other opinion, nationality, ethnic or social origin, disability, pregnancy, mental status or HIV status;
Download Employment Act 2007<http://www.labour.go.ke/index.php?option=com_docman&task=doc_download&gid=1&Itemid=75>(PDF)
On Tue, Jan 24, 2012 at 11:45 AM, Okechukwu <okechukwu@gmail.com>wrote:
May I refer all to the definition of discrimination. Discrimination can either be positive or negative and the biggest issue is that we all think of it as negative. If you have read a lot of South African labour laws then you will know what am talking about.
./Ok3ch
Sent from my iPad
On Jan 24, 2012, at 11:31 AM, John Ndambuki <johnmndambuki@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi All,
If I've understood the initial request correctly and the excerpt of the Constitution as posted by Joe, I think that the employer is not discriminating applicants for professing their alternative faith (or lack of it). They are simply choosing those with qualifications they require vis-à-vis those that lack the same. That is, they have not said, "do not apply because you are Hindu/Muslim/Atheist etc", they have just come out and said "we need a Christian for our (I assume Christian-based) organization.
Anyway, if someone has an issue regarding the request for applications, they can challenge the employer to explain why they have placed such a condition on the position. My assumption is that they are not merely seeking technical skills...
*Requirement*:
"An organization is seeking to hire for the mentioned entry level positions. The applicants must be of firm Christian Faith."
*Law*:
"A person may not be denied access to any institution, employment or facility, or the enjoyment of any right, because of the person's belief or religion."
Kind Regards
John Ndambuki
On Tue, Jan 24, 2012 at 11:15 AM, Rad! <conradakunga@gmail.com>wrote:
> If you replace Christian with Kalenjin, some people will also say > that is common sense. > > > On Tuesday, January 24, 2012, Peter Osotsi <peter.osotsi@gmail.com> > wrote: > > I would not be comfortable employing a Moslem to update my Church > website, or some "christian" to handle sensitive church matters they don't > subscribe to. Its common sense. Thats why some of us remained in the NO > camp because we were concerned about the numerous inconsistencies in the > new constitution. > > > > Peter > > > > On Tue, Jan 24, 2012 at 10:14 AM, Rad! <conradakunga@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> > >> My question is simple. > >> > >> We all know if that post said either of the following (and i > repeat, havinf no relevance to the job) there would be outrage > >> > >> - Candidate must be a Muslim > >> - Candidate be a Kikuyu > >> - Candidate must be on ODM member > >> - Candidate must be white > > > > _______________________________________________ > Skunkworks mailing list > Skunkworks@lists.my.co.ke > ------------ > List info, subscribe/unsubscribe > http://lists.my.co.ke/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/skunkworks > ------------ > > Skunkworks Rules > http://my.co.ke/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=94 > ------------ > Other services @ http://my.co.ke >
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